Jesses System

[Puddle]

Hi what is the best system for tying harris hawks down
MY little ****** has just found out how to undo knots anyone else had a problems like its :rolleyes: just wondered what system people use

[Shaun Byrne]

Which knot has he learned to untie?

[Tim Laycock]

A correctly tied falconers knot cant be undone by a bird

[Puddle]

the falconers knot m8 with a normal knot when I have finished tying it.
luckly she undone it in me front room

[Shaun Byrne]

A correctly tied falconers knot cant be undone by a bird

Exactly what I was going to say.

I've seen loads of pickers but never a bird that actually untied a correct falconers knot.

Not digging mate but are you definately tying the knot correctly?

[Rhondda Boy]

Hi what is the best system for tying harris hawks down
MY little ****** has just found out how to undo knots anyone else had a problems like its :rolleyes: just wondered what system people use



HAVE 4 YEAR OLD M/H/H....F...ING HOUDINI. CAN ESCAPE ANYTHING. 2 FALCONER KNOTS PLUS HALF KNOT, LEASH WITH 2 LOOPS AND SPRING CLIPS, STILL GOT OUT. READING WITH INTEREST

[Shaun Byrne]

HAVE 4 YEAR OLD M/H/H....F...ING HOUDINI. CAN ESCAPE ANYTHING. 2 FALCONER KNOTS PLUS HALF KNOT, LEASH WITH 2 LOOPS AND SPRING CLIPS, STILL GOT OUT. READING WITH INTEREST

Thats my theory done then:roll:

I'm out!

[Puddle]

Ive got one crafty h/h or maybe I need lessons!!!!!!!!

[Shaun Byrne]

Hi what is the best system for tying harris hawks down
MY little ****** has just found out how to undo knots anyone else had a problems like its :rolleyes: just wondered what system people use

Stick him on a post, problem solved!!

[Barbary Boy]

A correctly tied falconers knot cant be undone by a bird
boll * oks ive known a few harris hawks that have "escaped" the falconers knot! the only answer with these birds is a peice of chain or rope with a metal snap hook thingy on either end?

[Afshimo]

Got a few idea's...

use the double ended dog clips (get the ones from westweald as they dont break easily unlike the cheap ones) and clip that from your swivel to the ring.

Failing that, double ended quick links,

or the ones that you push on like carabina's but you have to lift the inside to slide off.

What about putting something bitter on the leash, so he wont like pulling at it.

Last resort, cellotape! (Ok, maybe not..)

Or maybe your bird is bored, get some tennis or dog ball's, cardbord stuff or move him/her around more.

My birds in moult and every week, she's moved around the garden, got a veriaty of ball's, bath with floating ball (thats hillariouse!) a swing lure thats jumps out of the grass at feeding time or hid under a flower pot so she doesnt see me give her the food. (prevent screaming at the same time)

Even if she doesnt find it amusing, i think its great finding stuff for her to destroy, play or mess around with.

Just a few idea's....


good luck!

[Tim Laycock]

boll * oks ive known a few harris hawks that have "escaped" the falconers knot! the only answer with these birds is a peice of chain or rope with a metal snap hook thingy on either end?

Its not boll * oks its my view based on my experience and if you disagree thats your perogative but perhaps you could voice your opinion without censoring yourself, the fact that you felt this was nessecary means you obviously knew it wasnt realy required :roll:

[Gosman_2]

Stick him on a post, problem solved!!
Had an imprint f/male gos as soon as u put her on the bow she would pull up the slack on the leash grab the ring [no not that one] and untie her self :!:

[StormHawker]

Hi Puddle

Got FHH, been tying falconers knot for years and she can undo them no probs! Double knots, treble knots.
I go along same idea as Barbary Boy. :supz:

[GoodFooter]

I know I am getting a bit repetitive but a loop leash ( with button one end loop the other) solves any houdini hawk problems!!!!!!:supz:

[Afshimo]

those arnt loop leashes, they're nick fox's, very good but take ages to undo (im still gettin used to them) check out IBR's stand at the falconry fair as they should sell them. that'd work lol.

[GoodFooter]

those arnt loop leashes, they're nick fox's, very good but take ages to undo (im still gettin used to them) check out IBR's stand at the falconry fair as they should sell them. that'd work lol.
they are loop leashes and would rather have a leash which takes 15 seconds to undo than a loose bird flying around with jesses and leash attached!!!!!!

[JB29]

I had problems with my peregrine tiercel undoing knots so now I have all my birds on what is effectively a short dog leash looped round the ring and the spring clip directly onto the swivel.

[OutFlying]

Loop leash

[Sprout]

I had problems with my peregrine tiercel undoing knots so now I have all my birds on what is effectively a short dog leash looped round the ring and the spring clip directly onto the swivel.
Spring clips are a disaster waiting to happen. NEVER trust them, sooner or later your bird will be off!

[GoodFooter]

I had problems with my peregrine tiercel undoing knots so now I have all my birds on what is effectively a short dog leash looped round the ring and the spring clip directly onto the swivel.
not convinced of this set up as 1) it adds weight to the swivel area 2) if it can undo a well tied knot it may well undo a spring clip 3) most of the dog spring clips have a groove which the tip of a beak could be snapped off on.
button loop leashes have yet to be faulted in my opinion.

[GriffMJ]

Is a two 6 inch nail system a bit extreme do you think :lol:

This harris female ...aptly named "Rogue" did the same thing in her first year..... she stopped after her first moult? We ended up putting a mountaineering clip onto her leash and clipped it onto the bow ring. Excuse the enormous flying jesses...handy for plucking her out of those high branches :)

http://www.m-jhoods.co.uk/images/Harris/meRogue2.JPG

Another pic of her.... dont let those good looks fool you... trixie little mare!
http://www.m-jhoods.co.uk/images/Harris/Rogue.JPG

[MoltenMetal]

i have heard a of some one who used dog clips for his birds was warned of the pending disaster but would not listen. but the clever haris undid it and tried to attack the eagle owl from what i heard the owl was full up for a while the harris was just wings :roll: :roll:

[Jack Merlin]

I'd give her something to chew on.

Smear English mustard on the leash.

Stopped my peregrine tiercel pulling at his jesses.

[HawkEyeUK]

spring clips never trust them! i only use them when out flying birds.. a double loop leash with a small carabina on the bow perch ring will do the job..

[Parabuteo.de]

I think the Nick Fox Leash/ tethering sytem he explaines in "Understnding the bird of prey" is the best choice. Never seen a bop untying this system.

Claas :o))

[Tim Laycock]

I'd give her something to chew on.

Smear English mustard on the leash.

Stopped my peregrine tiercel pulling at his jesses.

A simple solution to a problem that seems to tax many :lol:

[GriffMJ]

spring clips never trust them! i only use them when out flying birds.. a double loop leash with a small carabina on the bow perch ring will do the job..

Thats what we did.... just couldnt rem the name of "carabina" :) Should be renamed "HarrisFixas"

[Yarak1]

Hi what is the best system for tying harris hawks down
MY little ****** has just found out how to undo knots anyone else had a problems like its :rolleyes: just wondered what system people use

Here you go..it won't get off of these.................

I use these on difficult birds.namely hh that fiddle with the falconers knot..............I make these myself and have used them for the last 7 years.....................

[Yarak1]

Hi what is the best system for tying harris hawks down
MY little ****** has just found out how to undo knots anyone else had a problems like its :rolleyes: just wondered what system people use

A few pics of how they work.........The female in the pic is one on loan from Andy Younger.Flying weight 2.12

[GriffMJ]

A few pics of how they work.........The female in the pic is one on loan from Andy Younger.Flying weight 2.12

They look great John..... just a bit confused as to how you get them on? Does the plastic ball come off.... has it got a bar through the middle of the ball for quick release?

[SnakeHuts]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yarak1
A few pics of how they work.........The female in the pic is one on loan from Andy Younger.Flying weight 2.12


They look great John..... just a bit confused as to how you get them on? Does the plastic ball come off.... has it got a bar through the middle of the ball for quick release?
__________________

The button loop leash illustrated is one that Martin Underwood of Falconry Fabrications makes and sells, he will of course be at the Raptor Fair at Newport at the end of the month with an array of high quality, goodies including the loop leash.

[Wilfred]

I also do not see yet how the leash is fixed to the ring of the bow perch. And I am wondering why the plastic ball? What i mean is, that this might cause as much entangling as a button...maybe it would be even better solutiion to have a loop there also? So loops on both ends. But i make this remark assuming the plastic ball is really fixed to the leash and that you have some way of fixing the loop at the other end to the ring all the time?

[Kanati]

[QUOTE=Blackbird]A correctly tied falconers knot cant be undone by a bird[/QUOTE

I dont completely agree. the falconers knot tied 'porperly' can be untied by the hawk...but tie it properly and then pull on it hard to get it really tight and then you should be ok... I tie two knots and pull them both as tight as pos because i have had hawks get free with anything less then the tightest knots. the only trouble is, it can be a ****** to undo when you pull it that tight... but better safe then sorry.

[Parabuteo.de]

I also do not see yet how the leash is fixed to the ring of the bow perch. And I am wondering why the plastic ball? What i mean is, that this might cause as much entangling as a button...maybe it would be even better solutiion to have a loop there also? So loops on both ends. But i make this remark assuming the plastic ball is really fixed to the leash and that you have some way of fixing the loop at the other end to the ring all the time?

Keep thinking about it. It really works great!

The Leash has a Loop and a ball fixed to it. You put it through the Swivel then though the ring at the bowperch or somewhere and then again through the swivel and put the ball through the loop. Then fasten it all and NO bop will untie this system!

Claas

[GriffMJ]

Keep thinking about it. It really works great!

The Leash has a Loop and a ball fixed to it. You put it through the Swivel then though the ring at the bowperch or somewhere and then again through the swivel and put the ball through the loop. Then fasten it all and NO bop will untie this system!

Claas

aaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh :!: :!: :lol: Got it.... thanks Claas

[Yarak1]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yarak1
A few pics of how they work.........The female in the pic is one on loan from Andy Younger.Flying weight 2.12


They look great John..... just a bit confused as to how you get them on? Does the plastic ball come off.... has it got a bar through the middle of the ball for quick release?
__________________

The button loop leash illustrated is one that Martin Underwood of Falconry Fabrications makes and sells, he will of course be at the Raptor Fair at Newport at the end of the month with an array of high quality, goodies including the loop leash.

Totally wrong my friend.........Martin Underwood buys them from me the same as falconry originals do.......please get your facts right first!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[SnakeHuts]

John, sorry I accept your correction, best tell Martin to not make out he makes them. I know you work closely together, ive bought and used then very successfully from Martin a great piece of equipment.

Apologies .....slapped wrist

[StormRider]

Here you go..it won't get off of these.................

I use these on difficult birds.namely hh that fiddle with the falconers knot..............I make these myself and have used them for the last 7 years.....................
John , these are the same type I make and use. I first saw something similar being used by a falconer on the Isle of Man approx 7 years ago and have made them myself since. I could just see how perfect they were to use. The fact that the button is in effect a sphere takes all the edges away for any chord, etc to snag upon. It also makes it a lot easier for retrieving the elash back through for when you need to take it off.
I dont know if this is relevant but the only problem I have had, if it is indeed a problem, is that the only colour ball I can get my fhh to accept is black. Ive used green, blue and red with her and she used to get scatty on the perch. The black one just doesnt phase her at all.

As far as birds being unable to untie properly tied falconers knots is utter nonesense. Ive had 3 birds that have done this with no problems. I tie all my knots tightly and they still managed to suss it out. I find it difficult to swallow that we have a mod on here that gives out such strong misadvice on a matter that is so important yet simple.

STU

[Yarak1]

John, sorry I accept your correction, best tell Martin to not make out he makes them. I know you work closely together, ive bought and used then very successfully from Martin a great piece of equipment.

Apologies .....slapped wrist

No Problem,,although I don't work alongside Martin anymore for that exact reason...............Cheers, John

[Yarak1]

John , these are the same type I make and use. I first saw something similar being used by a falconer on the Isle of Man approx 7 years ago and I could see how perfect they were to use. The fact that the button is in effect a sphere takes all the edges away for any chord, etc to snag upon. It also makes it a lot easier for retrieving the elash back through for when you need to take it off.
I dont know if this is relevant but the only problem I have had, if it is indeed a problem, is that the only colour ball I can get my fhh to accept is black. Ive used green, blue and red with her and she used to get scatty on the perch. The black one just doesnt phase her at all.

As far as birds being unable to untie properly tied falconers knots is utter nonesense. Ive had 3 birds that have done this with no problems. I tie all my knots tightly and they still managed to suss it out. I find it difficult to swallow that we have a mod on here that gives out such strong misadvice on a matter that is so important yet simple.

STU

Hi Stu, I have only ever used black balls
( Excuse the remark) I agree with you that Harrises in particular CAN untie falconers knots hence the making of the loop!!!!

[Yarak1]

I also do not see yet how the leash is fixed to the ring of the bow perch. And I am wondering why the plastic ball? What i mean is, that this might cause as much entangling as a button...maybe it would be even better solutiion to have a loop there also? So loops on both ends. But i make this remark assuming the plastic ball is really fixed to the leash and that you have some way of fixing the loop at the other end to the ring all the time?

Hi Wilfred, I haven't had a problem with any tangling yet but I can see your point...........Tried to do it with 2 loops but it didn't work.................John

[DeathFromAbove]

Fair play those leashes do look good, i was with griff on that one, couldn't suss it out until parabuteo.de explained it.... well done that man! you gona have a stall at the fair yarak?

As for the leash untying thing, would have to agree and say that no matter how tight you do the knot some hawks will most surely manage to unpick them, mine did in her first year, a lil ****** she was, but as suggested by martin jones (someone mentioned it earlyer in thread also), I smeared english mustard onto the leash, works a treat!! once they try and get a taste of that mustard they'll not bother again. have had no probs since (touch wood).

[AndyYounger]

i recieved a cople of these leashes from john around a year ago. i only used one on a few ocasions as i was mainly using raptor posts at the time. they have a very good lifespan and are 100% safe.also quick and simple. i guess one of the best things is the leash length is always correct. i hate to see birds tethered with the leash to long.

Thums up for that one Yarak.

[Wilfred]

I think the Nick Fox Leash/ tethering sytem he explaines in "Understnding the bird of prey" is the best choice. Never seen a bop untying this system.

Claas :o))

claas..this nix fox leas/tethering system..is that the same as the one explained here? with the ball and loop at other end? or something completely different.

I can see that 2 loops would not work for the leash explained in this thread. And probably the plastic(?) ball wil not entangle as quick as a button. And for clever BOP's it certainly is an excellent solution i can see that. Excellent threat very interesting to read

[Sandalar]

Hi Yarak
this might be a daft question but how is that system attached at the bird end because what I see doesn't look possible without threading said bird through a rather small loop???
Thanks
Jonathan

[Yarak1]

Hi Yarak
this might be a daft question but how is that system attached at the bird end because what I see doesn't look possible without threading said bird through a rather small loop???
Thanks
Jonathan

Hi Jonathan, ok will try to explain......................Put the loop end through the swivel.........put loop end through the ring....back up through the underside of the swivel...........put loop over the ball and pull loop back down through the swivel so the loop is then at the ring end....................cheers John.

[Sandalar]

thanks john I'll have a fiddle
and sort it out
let you know when I get it
jonathan

[Yarak1]

thanks john I'll have a fiddle
and sort it out
let you know when I get it
jonathan

Not as hard as the rubic cube!!

[Yarak1]

thanks john I'll have a fiddle
and sort it out
let you know when I get it
jonathan

Jonathan, if you don't get it let me know and I will post pics showing you how.....cheers

[NorthenEnglandHawker]

dont think nobodies mentioned it but why not free-loft him:confused: easier for u and better for him win win situation:supz:

[Dave G]

i purchased one of those leashes from the ibr as my hawk kept undoing his knotts good job i always did 2;) any way when it arrived i just sat there scratching my head thinking how the hell do i get this to work so phoned the ibr and neil explained the way ;) throu the swivel goes the leash then throu the bow perch ring then the loop goes back throu the swivel and over the button , your hawk needs to be nice and steady for the first few goes then all is well lol

[Sandalar]

Hi Jonathan, ok will try to explain......................Put the loop end through the swivel.........put loop end through the ring....back up through the underside of the swivel...........put loop over the ball and pull loop back down through the swivel so the loop is then at the ring end....................cheers John.
That's so cool
finally got all the bits together to try it out . I borrowed one of my daughters beads and some raffia string but that makes so much sense when you have it sitting infront of you.
I have a feeling it will be easier with the right materials but you could always tie falconers knot first then sort it out slowly the first few times you use it.I used a curtain ring and an old leather lace to act as bird and perch.they are abit inanimate but they did the job well.
I can't see a weaver bird being able to sort that out never mind houdini harris.
Thanks very much John.
Blessings Jonathan

[Parabuteo.de]

aaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh :!: :!: :lol: Got it.... thanks Claas

you are welcome!

Claas :o))

[Puzo]

I'd give her something to chew on.

Smear English mustard on the leash.

Stopped my peregrine tiercel pulling at his jesses.

I've heard of the same thing being done with onions

[Tim Laycock]

Hawks cant smell but they can certainly taste!

The phrase "Once bitten" was never so applickable before :yawinkle: