Tail mounts

[Sprout]

How do people prefer to mount their tail bells/telemetry?? I have always glued 2 narrow strips of leather around the top of the centre decks, poked the ends through a plectrum and cable tied the bell through 2 small holes near the plectrum - will try and post pics later. However, I don't like securing the 2 decks close to each other with restricted movement allowed between them - anyone with any better suggestions??

[Tim Laycock]

I mount the plectrum similar to yourself Karl but I secure it top and bottom, leaving enough slack in the leather "Straps" to allow free movement of the deck feathers.

(Anyone who has been whipped in the face or across the ear by the telemetry ariel on a frosty day will know what a good idea it is to secure the mount top and bottom :lol: )

[Ben C]

Same as Karl..although truth be told PCHAY fitted it while drunk as a lord. However it worked well for the season.

However I have found a NEW glueing compound, that is a cross between super glue and araldite. i.e it glues fast but without the brittle nature of the old super glue!!!! Champion.

[MoltenMetal]

well what is it:?: :?:

[Ben C]

Sorry MM..........PMSL......it's called........'superaraldite'........:oops: :oops:


Go and have a look in B&Q...:supz: :supz:

[Venividevenatio]

I use Martin Jones telemetry mounts direct to feather, glued with Araldite Rapid, pinched between finger and thumb, and carefuly finished with pliers. Use two, one for telemetry tag and one for a bell fitted with cable tie. Tag fitted on feather next to the left deck feather. Bell mount fitted to right hand deck. Care needed in final closing stage, and in cleaning surplus glue from channel . After allowing a day for glue to realy go off, I then test the mount with a transmitter for a couple of days before using it for real. Works OK for me.

[Sprout]

So I should stick with how I know then?? Seems everyone else does similar. Mind you, what is the best glue? Tried araldite but seems like takes donkeys ages to set so don;t trust to leave it, I've also stuck fingers to birds ass's with superglue!!!! Need a compromise. That superaraldite sounds like worth a try

[LongVVing]

Have any of you guys used the backpack type mount for your transmitters?
I have been thinking about using this type and would be interested to know what anyone thinks of them.

It will be for a female peregrine by the way.

Mark

[Sprout]

I used a back pack for my tiercel minor this year, worked great but pain in the ass to fit!!!!

[Saker-Clive]

Sprout..........Araldite Rapid is what you want, it only takes about 10 minutes to go off.
Mix it up and let it stand for a minute or so, then plough into it:supz:

if you can get some Super Glue activator, you can spray that onto the pieces to be glued, then apply the Super Glue and it sets almost instantly.
I finish off my bewits like this, just for added protection.
HTH

[Sprout]

Sprout..........Araldite Rapid is what you want, it only takes about 10 minutes to go off.
Mix it up and let it stand for a minute or so, then plough into it:supz:

if you can get some Super Glue activator, you can spray that onto the pieces to be glued, then apply the Super Glue and it sets almost instantly.
I finish off my bewits like this, just for added protection.
HTH
Might just be me but don't like having to cast a hawk for that long to ensure its gone off

[Saker-Clive]

Once the glue is on the 2 little staps and cable tied thats it!!!!..............providing you don't slop the glue everywhere you shouldn't have a problem.
No mess.
It shouldn't any longer than about 4 minutes max. not as long as when coping the beak.

[Tasha55403]

We used the Marshall tailmount on my redtail. We even got the pliers to go with it. Worked fantastic. Very easy to put on too. We used 5 minute epoxy to glue it on, though it didn't really seem to need it much it fit so well. Greg likes to make homemade tailmounts by soldering a 22 shell casing and a little electrical thingy-ma-bob. He can even solder a bell right onto it. It's not too pretty, but it IS very functional:lol:

[GregMik]

Another thing,
Don't use "superglue", it will melt feathers and is not water resistant. When you put it on the shaft it melts the shaft and will actually weaken the glued area. If your bird will be near water, and beings most are from GB, I think you should find a better water resistant glue. I have seen Friends that have imped feathers with superglue and they flew ducks with a gos, it lasted about a week and they had to reimp.

The best glue that I have found is 5 minute epoxy. The kind you get in a syringe that has two sides. You have to mix the hardener with the epoxy, and it will harden in 5 minutes. What I do it make two batches 2 minutes apart and then when the first is 2 to three minutes old I cast the bird and put the prefitted mount on. You can prefit the mount if the bird is hooded and on the fist. The mount should click on then tightened on with a pliers. The Marshall mount with the prefitted pliers works really well. If you screw it up you have two minutes to redo what you screwed up with the second batch. With a calm bird you can do all this on the fist or perch. I also put a piece of paper between the feathers to isolate it in the train.

I also have soldered a Pakistani bell to a crimp on electrical connector for the tail bell. And don't believe Tasha, I have made a couple that look nice, I think I need some new soldier and flux, as they are really old, for the next couple I make. If you want Pics....just ask.

Greg

[Ben C]

Need a compromise. That superaraldite sounds like worth a try


It is excellent stuff. Comes in two seperate tubes like the original araldite, but smells like supaglue. I will get the exact name on monday. We use it to glue the claywork together when it breaks, strong as an ox and has not got that brittle white flaking.

[Ben C]

Greg...pictures please!

[OutFlying]

Ben,
The lads from Bristol mount the leather telemetry plectrum without any glue, 4 tie wraps never comes loose - fitted in seconds.

Used it for the last 6 seasons, done numerous other people hawks - never had a failure.

Jim.

[Ben C]

Interesting,

I hadn't thought like that as receieved wisdom is to use glue........mmmmmm food for thought Jim, thanks.

[OutFlying]

If I've time I put up a series of photographs to illustrate fitting.

Jim

ps Need to take the photo's first and make up a new plectrum. ;)

[Ben C]

Please do......make sure there in focus, like mine always are....PMSL:rolleyes:

[OutFlying]

Will try my best Ben,

It's also possible to fit it without casting, but you need a steady hawk.

Jim.

[Harrisii]

I mount the plectrum similar to yourself Karl but I secure it top and bottom, leaving enough slack in the leather "Straps" to allow free movement of the deck feathers.

(Anyone who has been whipped in the face or across the ear by the telemetry ariel on a frosty day will know what a good idea it is to secure the mount top and bottom :lol: )


WHERE ARE THESE TAIL MOUNTS AVAILABLE FROM BB???

i usually have a tail bell and put the telem on the anklet but want to get away fom this set up.
i would like a tail mount where i can have both bell and telem' on the two deck feathers.
i purchased the following and think they are great but fear they may be a little weighty for my MHH when bell and telem' is attatched.
whats the max weight you guys would put on a tail feathers??
would like to know where i can puchase similar tail mounts which house bell and telem, so if you guys could put me in the right direction, would appreciate.

the tail mounts i will be using::
www.lancsfalconry.co.uk/tailmount.htm

[Ben C]

Ask eddie at Falconry electronics.

[Harrisii]

Ask eddie at Falconry electronics.

http://www.falconryelectronics.co.uk/page8.html
cheers ben

[Adam Barrett]

Will try my best Ben,

It's also possible to fit it without casting, but you need a steady hawk.

Jim.

If i remember gaz did a thread on this with step by step pictures, ill have a dig around see if i can find it.:-)

ATb
Adam

[Sprout]

Cheers guys, useful info - will try the rapidaraldite I think.

[Tim Laycock]

WHERE ARE THESE TAIL MOUNTS AVAILABLE FROM BB???


Mine is home made m8 :yawinkle:

The FE ones are fine though

[OutFlying]

Tim,
I think the home made leather plectrums are the best option, they flex and bend with the feathers unlike the mass produced hard plastic options out there.

Piece of cake to make and simple to fit.


Jim.

[Ben C]

How does the telem and bell fit onto the leather?

[OutFlying]

I post a picture and show you - now off to make one :lol:

[OutFlying]

Here you are Ben.

Brass rectangular tubeing from model shop, small flexible tie wraps needed.

The top two holes are for mounting to the tail feathers, 2 other holes in the center are required for the bell - all fastening are tie wraps.

[OutFlying]

Final assembly, note how bell fastened.

[Ben C]

That is cock on!!! Not sure about that bell, might have to sort you out with a decent pair of bi-coloured ones, slightly larger than the last set.

I have been shown a way to attach the bell using those rubber bands that farmers use on lambs tails. It pushed the bell upwards like the one shown in your photographs, but because its rubber is moves around and rattles the bell more than a solid fixture.

[OutFlying]

Now tail fitting instructions,

Fit 2 tie wraps to center decks, pull tight but not too tight as to squash the quill (it's easy to get the right tension without damaging the shaft ;) ).

Then slide the plectrum down the uncut tiewraps. When fully down, use 2 more tiewraps to lock the plectrum down. Finally cut the tails off the four tiewraps.

Thats it fitted, they don't come lose or need glue. Plectrum made in minutes, fitted in seconds.

Jim.

ps Hope you like the straws, and the bells are off your talkative secret bellmaking mate - aka Larry Counce

[Ben C]

Got it!!! Nice............Simple and unfussy........now all I have to do is keep Liam bloody PCHAY away from the arse end of my hawk.


PS. I knew they were counces, jealous as hell about that 'quiet' man :yawinkle:

[OutFlying]

don't forget the green square :rolleyes: :lol:

[Ben C]

Already done...........have a look!!!!


Mods: This thread needs to be put in an archive!!!!!! Along with a few more if you can sort it....:supz:

[OutFlying]

Already done...........have a look!!!!


Mods: This thread needs to be put in an archive!!!!!! Along with a few more if you can sort it....:supz:


I'd already seen it ;) ,

This season i'm going to try fixing the tube to leather using tiny rivets, one on each side. Need a dremal to get the shape for the brass tube with an elongated flat top and bottom, then rivet these sections. Once done I'll post an update.

Jim.

[Ben C]

Would that not tear away from the leather???

[Tim Laycock]

Here is a closeup of mine.
I solder a small piece of the same telemetry tube to the telemetry tube and the bell is cable tied to this.
(I use round tube)

The whole lot has copper wire passed over it and this is also soldered.
These wires are then passed through the plectrum, secured and finaly the whole issue is smoothed over with Araldite Rapid

[OutFlying]

Would that not tear away from the leather???

a backing plate will be used, then i'll test the setup with pliers to confirm if useable.

Jim.

[Kevin Massey]

Jim did you post the attaching with 4 cable ties on here a while back?(ive been looking for ages some how i thought it was hawka that posted it)

i have been using this ever since i see it....i also put a spot of rapid on the closing tie ends and with a hot knife melt over the snipped off ends (for a bit more security and a smoother finnish

[Tim Laycock]

Jim did you post the attaching with 4 cable ties on here a while back?(ive been looking for ages some how i thought it was hawka that posted it)


It was WW :yawinkle:

[Kevin Massey]

It was WW :yawinkle:

but it was this forum...yes:roll: :rolleyes:

[Tim Laycock]

but it was this forum...yes:roll: :rolleyes:

I cant remember everything for you! :rolleyes: :lol:

[OutFlying]

He did it on the Ukgoshawkers list, and maybe on here.

Jim.

[Tim Laycock]

It was definatly on a forum in addition to Goshawkers

[Ben C]

Pmsl.......

[Sprout]

Cheers OF, makes sense with the cable ties. My technique was very similar but with glued strips of leather around the decks rather than the cable ties - just tried your way on some old feathers and certainly far more simple and less potential to be messy/go wrong so think you have converted me! One slight alteration though, I personally prefer the bell to be a little looser, held rigid limits some of the sound from the bell in my opinion.

[Harrisii]

brilliant thread, learning more on this method of tail mounting.
sent for the mounts at FE, but would obviously like to make my own too.
now OF and BB, where do i get the brass tubing??

plenty learned here, cheers guys.

[Ben C]

brilliant thread, learning more on this method of tail mounting.
sent for the mounts at FE, but would obviously like to make my own too.
now OF and BB, where do i get the brass tubing??

plenty learned here, cheers guys.

As OF said.......a model shop:yawinkle:

[Harrisii]

As OF said.......a model shop:yawinkle:

yeah, never out of these places Ben.
i havent a clue where my nearest model shop is. been searching the web looking for these places. need to dig out my anorak before i go looking.

just thought there may be somewhere easier and handy, like ebay or something. not easy to find ben, been trying most the night.
cheers for your insight Ben. most helpfull. lol

[GregMik]

.22 shell casing. With the end cut off. Kinda thin but they work.

Greg

[Harrisii]

.22 shell casing. With the end cut off. Kinda thin but they work.

Greg

good idea Greg but we dont live in a gun totting country like yourself mate.
pmsl. hope you are well viking. stay cool.

thanks for your input, will keep this in mind, my friend.

[Ben C]

yeah, never out of these places Ben.
i havent a clue where my nearest model shop is. been searching the web looking for these places. need to dig out my anorak before i go looking.

just thought there may be somewhere easier and handy, like ebay or something. not easy to find ben, been trying most the night.
cheers for your insight Ben. most helpfull. lol


Don't get you arse in a twist mon amie :supz: :goodman:

B&Q will sort you and yours. :wink:

[Harrisii]

Don't get you arse in a twist mon amie :supz: :goodman:

B&Q will sort you and yours. :wink:

mmmmmmm,
thanks once again Ben C. you have been helpfull more than once today.
that must be some kind of record. your green building block is in the post.
thanks.

[Ben C]

I am always helpful........its just that the masses can't see it...........PMSL. Seems to me your well grumpy Harrisii.........:roll: :confused:

[Harrisii]

I am always helpful........its just that the masses can't see it...........PMSL. Seems to me your well grumpy Harrisii.........:roll: :confused:

who you been speaking too???
and what makes you say that???
yes, i suppose you may be right. i am turning into an ole grouch. pmsl.
grumpy old git. but hey its close season and i am redundant. there is an excuse.

[GregMik]

Well,
I was going to take a couple pics of my tail mounts. But somebody took all the CF cards for the cameras with her. So I have no way to take the pics. You all will have to wait for Tasha to get home.

Greg

[Harrisii]

Well,
I was going to take a couple pics of my tail mounts. But somebody took all the CF cards for the cameras with her. So I have no way to take the pics. You all will have to wait for Tasha to get home.

Greg

look forward to seeing your pics for more ideas Greg.
great pics from OF and BB, thanks guys, food for thought.

[Hacker]

good idea Greg but we dont live in a gun totting country like yourself mate.
pmsl. hope you are well viking. stay cool.

thanks for your input, will keep this in mind, my friend.
PM me your address and i will send you a load of .22 casings m8.

[OutFlying]

brilliant thread, learning more on this method of tail mounting.
sent for the mounts at FE, but would obviously like to make my own too.
now OF and BB, where do i get the brass tubing??

plenty learned here, cheers guys.

Most DIY shops, or maybe a model railway online shop etc. Round tube, square or rectangle section it's just personal choice - I prefer the rectangular tubing as it easier to put on / remove the Marshalls RT + transmitter with one hand whilst the gos is on the glove, the spring clip is quite thick. The luksander, marshall micro and merlin transmitter suit the round tubing.


Jim.

[Tim Laycock]

I got my brass tube from B&Q, they sell round and rectangular section

[OutFlying]

Cheers OF, makes sense with the cable ties. My technique was very similar but with glued strips of leather around the decks rather than the cable ties - just tried your way on some old feathers and certainly far more simple and less potential to be messy/go wrong so think you have converted me! One slight alteration though, I personally prefer the bell to be a little looser, held rigid limits some of the sound from the bell in my opinion.

If fitting looser just make sure the bell isn't hitting the transmitter top or brass tubing, maybe a longer leather plectrum would be the better option - giving the bell more room.

Jim.

[OutFlying]

Finally - USE a thin, weak tie wrap for the bell mounting, if the bell hits an object (branch, wire, brambles etc) the bell will detach without pulling the decks feathers out, leaving the transmitter still attached to the hawk.

Jim.

[SSL]

Finally - USE a thin, weak tie wrap for the bell mounting, if the bell hits an object (branch, wire, brambles etc) the bell will detach without pulling the decks feathers out, leaving the transmitter still attached to the hawk.

Jim.

Jim,

Could you mount this leather plectrum top and bottom or is there no need?

[OutFlying]

Steve,
I haven't found the need, just use a good thick piece of kangeroo leather. The tie wraps fitted in this way (through the plectrum) make it very solid on the feathers - no flapping about like the Falconry Electronics fitting that uses the other type of fixing.

Jim.

[SSL]

Steve,
I haven't found the need, just use a good thick piece of kangeroo leather. The tie wraps fitted in this way (through the plectrum) make it very solid on the feathers - no flapping about like the Falconry Electronics fitting that uses the other type of fixing.

Jim.

Cheers Jim,

I'll give them a try.

Steve.

[Harrisii]

Most DIY shops, or maybe a model railway online shop etc. Round tube, square or rectangle section it's just personal choice - I prefer the rectangular tubing as it easier to put on / remove the Marshalls RT + transmitter with one hand whilst the gos is on the glove, the spring clip is quite thick. The luksander, marshall micro and merlin transmitter suit the round tubing.


Jim.

cheers Jim, got it from B&Q.
ROUND SECTION STUFF NO SQUARE THERE.
WHAT IVE DONE WHEN PUTTING THE GROOVES IN FOR TO HOLD THE TRANSMITTER CLIPS WAS SLIGHTLY SQUASH THE BRASS TUBE CREATING AN OVAL SHAPE RATHER THAN ROUND, MAKES IT A LOT EASIER.
FOLLOWED YOUR DESIGN JIM BUT USED LIGHT WEIGHT PLASTIC RATHER THAN LEATHER, THEY WILL DO A TURN I AM SURE. PLEASED WITH THEM I AM.

JUST ONE THING JIM, CAN I ASK WHY THE BELL SHOULD NOT TOUCH THE BRASS TUBE OR TELEM CLIP??

[OutFlying]

It damages the bell and kills the sound.

Jim.

[Harris]

If you can't get hold of any copper tubing, try and get your hands on an old chrome telescopic care arial, you then have several lengths of varous diameter tube :yawinkle:

[LanczSpringer]

this is a great thread!

top postings..

I used the FE mount this year first attemp was using leather straps on the decks held in place by 4 cable ties no glue!

He had it off within a week or two, second attempt was using the same leather straps but rapid arldited and 4 cable ties (two on each deck) also used talc to sprinkle on glue whilst allowing to dry.

No problems, but the mount did move horizontally due to how it was secured, I think Jims method is great, may need to look at how the brass tube is secured onto the leather, cant quite see how its done yet.

[OutFlying]

Lancz,
It just another small tiewrap, look at the first 3 photographs.

Jim.

[Gaz]

Rim fire casing...cut & soldered...pattern...cord to attach bell (ends heated & "blobbed"to hold,but will pull through & detach if bell gets caught)...& a blue peter...(one i did earlier):supz:

[Gaz]

..ooppps:oops: :!: ..forgot the pic:supz:

[Reuben]

How do people prefer to mount their tail bells/telemetry?? I have always glued 2 narrow strips of leather around the top of the centre decks, poked the ends through a plectrum and cable tied the bell through 2 small holes near the plectrum - will try and post pics later. However, I don't like securing the 2 decks close to each other with restricted movement allowed between them - anyone with any better suggestions??

I use a similar method but with ONE leather strip through the tailmount and attached to the two centre decks with doublesided tape ( of the type used to fix reflector radiator panels),narrow and very adhesive. Two ties on each deck secure the mount (the edges of the tape also secure the ties)
The only slack is in the centre of the leather strap in order to allow movement in the decks and tail bell
Reuben

[MickeyDredd]

How many of you Gos guys have lost deck feathers on fences etc due to tailmounting bells? Is it a common hazard of mounting the bells on the tail rather than on the leg?

Ta
MD

[Hacker]

My HH was left hanging 20 0dd feet up in a tree when a twig went through the transmitter mount wires.
He lost his deck feather when it broke by the mount, good thing really or he may have hung himself.

[OutFlying]

How many of you Gos guys have lost deck feathers on fences etc due to tailmounting bells? Is it a common hazard of mounting the bells on the tail rather than on the leg?

Ta
MD


It's happen twice to me MD.

[MickeyDredd]

It's happen twice to me MD.

But you still use this method, so presumably the disadvantage of losing a deck feather at any time during the season is not such that you would now consider leg-mounting the bells?

Cheers
MD

[OutFlying]

I now use a system, that the bell will detatch before the feathers are pulled.

Jim.

[OutFlying]

The first time it happen, tx aerial caught on barb wire.

Second time bell hit a tree branch.

Jim.

[Kevin Massey]

I now use a system, that the bell will detatch before the feathers are pulled.

Jim.

i presume a weak link? Jim have you ever lost a bell then and though "good job?"

[OutFlying]

Yes Kev, use the thinnest weakest tie wrap you can buy.


Yes have lost a bell :P


Jim.

[MickeyDredd]

I now use a system, that the bell will detatch before the feathers are pulled.

Jim.

makes sense! rather lose the bell than the feather :lol:

The very first time I used telemetry was on my MHH when we were flying blue hare (tried to get him and a female to work as a cast on them). The first flight he had at one he hit it on the back end, the hare bucked him off and I was left with a deck feather sitting in the heather with the telemetry attached!!!

It was a telemetry baptism which did not impress me, having never used it in my first two season's hawking :roll:

[BlackHawke]

i have always glued the tail mount straight onto a single feather. To date its never fallen off. my way of thinking, if the plectrum type tail mount is put onto 2 or 3 feathers if it gets caught bird may pull out more than 1 tail feather. or on the other hand, using just 1 tail feather, bit of a safety feature prob a bit more difficult to pull out 3 tail feathers if you bird gets stuck!

i also put the bell on the transmitter frame stops the bird pulling on the bell in the aviary.

[MickeyDredd]

i have always glued the tail mount straight onto a single feather. my way of thinking, if the plectrum type tail mount is put onto 2 or 3 feathers if it gets caught bird may pull out more than 1 tail feather.

Me too Rob, and that was my thinking also ;)

[Harrisii]

Rim fire casing...cut & soldered...pattern...cord to attach bell (ends heated & "blobbed"to hold,but will pull through & detach if bell gets caught)...& a blue peter...(one i did earlier):supz:

great pics.
can i ask, how do you fit the tube mount to the plectrum mate.

ive cable tied it like previous pics on the thread, and ive soldered coper wire on to back and through leather plectrum etc.
just qurious to see how you have done it mate. always lookin for ways to improve etc.
cheers.

[LanczSpringer]

Here is a closeup of mine.
I solder a small piece of the same telemetry tube to the telemetry tube and the bell is cable tied to this.
(I use round tube)

The whole lot has copper wire passed over it and this is also soldered.
These wires are then passed through the plectrum, secured and finaly the whole issue is smoothed over with Araldite Rapid

Tim, what are the four holes for on your mount?

[Tim Laycock]

Top and bottom mounting.

The leather straps are cabletied to the decks low down just after the start of the webbing, the plectrum is then threaded on and the leather is secured at the top.

Hope this makes sense

[Jastreb]

Fitted tail mount only for transmitter on Jims's way - EXCELLENT!!!!!!!! :supz::supz:
Cheersn Viktor

[OutFlying]

Good man Viktor,

Here's the thread for your tailmount Wullie.


Jim.

[Jastreb]

Cheers Jim, will post pics tommorow :supz:

[HawkNorth]

A ? your birds that lost there decks did they grow back next molt

[OutFlying]

Fitted tail mount only for transmitter on Jims's way - EXCELLENT!!!!!!!! :supz::supz:
Cheersn Viktor

Fitted 7 goshawks and one harrishawk already this month - still yet to do my own :rolleyes:


Jim.

[Berkut]

A ? your birds that lost there decks did they grow back next molt
No never came back unfortunately.

[Adam Barrett]

Fitted 7 goshawks and one harrishawk already this month - still yet to do my own


Jim.

would you mind giving me a hand in a few weeks jim mate? Last season i did it myself when he was sat on the lure, it worked but looked less than perfect:roll:

not long now! im like a bull at a gate:supz: :lol: :supz:

[Nige]

Sprout
I make my own and fit the same as you do. As long as you have a little play in the leather you don't seem to get any issues. If you study your bird when the tail is open the decks have very little movement in them. I have also used longer strips of leather and fixed it to the feathers next to the decks so as to spread the load over four feathers, but it made no real difference but the strips have to be long enough so as not to restrict movement.

[OutFlying]

would you mind giving me a hand in a few weeks jim mate? Last season i did it myself when he was sat on the lure, it worked but looked less than perfect:roll:

not long now! im like a bull at a gate:supz: :lol: :supz:


Not a problem Adam.

Jim.

[HawkNorth]

Fitted tail mount only for transmitter on Jims's way - EXCELLENT!!!!!!!! :supz::supz:
Cheersn Viktor

Do you use a tail guard

[OutFlying]

I sent him one.

[Paul42]

I mount the plectrum similar to yourself Karl but I secure it top and bottom, leaving enough slack in the leather "Straps" to allow free movement of the deck feathers.

(Anyone who has been whipped in the face or across the ear by the telemetry ariel on a frosty day will know what a good idea it is to secure the mount top and bottom :lol: )


mount the same way as blackbird..

[Argee]

mount the same way as blackbird..

straddling the hen ????:rolleyes:
(*v*) ...

[Harris]

This is the method I use

http://www.lancsfalconry.co.uk/tailmount.htm

[Mick Postin]

Hi,
Quite new so don't bite...Can anyone comment on the usefulness or otherwise of the 'special' cable tie type tail bell mounts. Just that the idea seem a lot quicker and less messy than other methods of mounting...if they work...:?:
__________________
Mickpoz

[OutFlying]

Which type are you refering too ?

Jim.

ps Are we talking bell mounting or plectrum ?

[GregMik]

I have made my tail bells to angle back so as to reduce the tendency of a branch or something catching it.

Here is the thread, but it is not much good right now as the pics won't show up.

http://www.falconryforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=14254


Greg

[Argee]

I have made my tail bells to angle back so as to reduce the tendency of a branch or something catching it.

Here is the thread, but it is not much good right now as the pics won't show up.

http://www.falconryforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=14254


Greg


Tease ....;)
(*V*) ...

[LanczSpringer]

I'd already seen it ;) ,

This season i'm going to try fixing the tube to leather using tiny rivets, one on each side. Need a dremal to get the shape for the brass tube with an elongated flat top and bottom, then rivet these sections. Once done I'll post an update.

Jim.

Jim did you managed to do this?

I used your method and it was very easy! Although I may have to redo one of the tail ties as hes pulled it down a little, I didnt want to over thighten it but think it could do with being a litle tighter, dont know if I will be able to just pull it tighter might have to take that side off and totally redo it?

[OutFlying]

Hello Anthony,
I stayed with the tiny tie wrap design and it proved it works with Joe's gos, the tie wrap snapped whilst entering cover with the brass tube still attached to the transmitter without pulling the centre deck feathers - the transmitter aerial had snagged on the hedge.

The tie wrap for the mount needs to be pulled tight and have no movement on the feather - so can try retightning but may have to start again.


Jim.

[LanczSpringer]

Yep just redone it!

Its great, just hood the bird and its no hastle at all, no casting required little or no stress to the bird!

Great method

[Lyn Birds]

So I should stick with how I know then?? Seems everyone else does similar. Mind you, what is the best glue? Tried araldite but seems like takes donkeys ages to set so don;t trust to leave it, I've also stuck fingers to birds ass's with superglue!!!! Need a compromise. That superaraldite sounds like worth a try

whenever i use superglue to fasten tail mounts i place a piece of a4 paper underneath the decks but before i remove paper i sprinkle plenty of talcum power over it dry,s the glue and stops sticking works a treat

[GregMik]

whenever i use superglue to fasten tail mounts i place a piece of a4 paper underneath the decks but before i remove paper i sprinkle plenty of talcum power over it dry,s the glue and stops sticking works a treat


Lyn,

Super glue melts feathers and will weaken them. It is better to use 5 minute epoxy, it will not melt the feather and is not water soluble. Super glue is effected by water.


Greg

[Lyn Birds]

Lyn,

Super glue melts feathers and will weaken them. It is better to use 5 minute epoxy, it will not melt the feather and is not water soluble. Super glue is effected by water.


Greg

ok thanks for that you learn something new everyday although ive never come across any probs but ill take it on board cheers

[Argee]

ok thanks for that you learn something new everyday although ive never come across any probs but ill take it on board cheers

could i suggest you look at
'just a thought' .. image .
in the Telemetry thread ,
regards ,
(*v*) ...

[Lyn Birds]

could i suggest you look at
'just a thought' .. image .
in the Telemetry thread ,
regards ,
(*v*) ...

cheers looked at thread

[OutFlying]

Fitted tail mount only for transmitter on Jims's way - EXCELLENT!!!!!!!! :supz::supz:
Cheersn Viktor

Fitted my own tonight, had 4 duff tiewraps :-| and needed 2 attempts to get it right - why does it always happen when you do your own hawk and not when you do someone elses ?

Jim.

[Big JoeJoe]

Hello Anthony,
I stayed with the tiny tie wrap design and it proved it works with Joe's gos, the tie wrap snapped whilst entering cover with the brass tube still attached to the transmitter without pulling the centre deck feathers - the transmitter aerial had snagged on the hedge.

The tie wrap for the mount needs to be pulled tight and have no movement on the feather - so can try retightning but may have to start again.


Jim.

Very true Jim:supz: :supz: :supz:

[Argee]

whenever i use superglue to fasten tail mounts i place a piece of a4 paper underneath the decks but before i remove paper i sprinkle plenty of talcum power over it dry,s the glue and stops sticking works a treat

as an add-on to this suggestion .. i used the Mite Dust ...

(*v*) ...

[Argee]

What's to stop 'you' stapling a pair feathers , any thing of the same calibre could do , to a piece of card or and old shoe ,whatever, and practice this 'attaching ' before tussling with your bird ?
(*v*) ...

[DeathFromAbove]

Now tail fitting instructions,

Fit 2 tie wraps to center decks, pull tight but not too tight as to squash the quill (it's easy to get the right tension without damaging the shaft ;) ).

Then slide the plectrum down the uncut tiewraps. When fully down, use 2 more tiewraps to lock the plectrum down. Finally cut the tails off the four tiewraps.

Thats it fitted, they don't come lose or need glue. Plectrum made in minutes, fitted in seconds.

Jim.

ps Hope you like the straws, and the bells are off your talkative secret bellmaking mate - aka Larry Counce

Like this method mate, been using leather myself similar to sprouts method. You may just have converted me to this one mate..... just one question though...... once fitted, if the bird were to pull on the tail mount as alot do when it first goes on, would the pulling not over tighten the ties around the feather shafts, crushing or weakening the feather at that point? or would you put a dab of glue into the mechanism once taught enough to effectively 'freeze' the movement of the cable tie to prevent this?

ATB - Stu

[OutFlying]

Not possible to tighten further, the one fixed to the feather is below the plectrum and the one above wouldn't affect the tension on the feather.

No glue is used.

Jim.

[DeathFromAbove]

Not possible to tighten further, the one fixed to the feather is below the plectrum and the one above wouldn't affect the tension on the feather.

No glue is used.

Jim.

Hehe, I see we're a bit misunderstood here my friend. What I mean is once all assembled and fitted if the bird were to pull on the plectrum itself in an attempt to remove it, the tie around the feather now fixed to the plectrum via the other cable tie end will still be able to be moved tighter around the quill with enough force from the bird pulling, possibly damaging the quill in the process. This is the only flaw I can see in the method and one that should be remedied IMO with a spot of glue in the mechanism of the tie around the quill to 'freeze' the movement of the tie any tighter. What you think bud?

You see where I'm coming from mate? - all in all though it's a very neat and easy method and one that I'll be using this season to try it out :wink:

[OutFlying]

It's fitted to dozens of hawks for many years, every year, never heard of it happening. Seen the bell / transmitter hit objects and pull the bell or transmitter off by snapping the tiewrap that holds the brass tube - the feathers didn't suffer from damage from the tiewraps.

But if you want to glue them for piece of mind then do so - but if using glue you might as well use leather for fixing.

Jim.

[DeathFromAbove]

It's fitted to dozens of hawks for many years, every year, never heard of it happening. Seen the bell / transmitter hit objects and pull the bell or transmitter off by snapping the tiewrap that holds the brass tube - the feathers didn't suffer from damage from the tiewraps.

But if you want to glue them for piece of mind then do so - but if using glue you might as well use leather for fixing.

Jim.

True mate - not ripping holes in the technique mate, like it alot, just wondered if what I was explaining had happened before is all bud :wink:

[OutFlying]

It ain't my technique, shown by someone else.

I don't think the tiewrap can be tighten by hawk whilst fitted but as you know **** can happen - more chance of it pulling down the feather I would have thought.

All the best Jim.

[Nig295]

It's that time of year again, I have read this whole thread and got some graet ideas but I am stuck in two minds.

Last year my mHH lost a deck when he skimmed a fence and the antenna snagged, it didn't grow back this year. I want to use a tail mount again but as there is already one deck missing am I taking a huge risk of having 2 more missing if I use the plectrum?

If he ends up with 3 tail feathers missing is that the end of his hunting career to all intents and purposes?

[Jastreb]

Fitted my own tonight, had 4 duff tiewraps :-| and needed 2 attempts to get it right - why does it always happen when you do your own hawk and not when you do someone elses ?

Jim.

Tell me about it!

[Dangerous Dave]

Finally - USE a thin, weak tie wrap for the bell mounting, if the bell hits an object (branch, wire, brambles etc) the bell will detach without pulling the decks feathers out, leaving the transmitter still attached to the hawk.

Jim.

Hi Jim i have looked thru this thread for pictures of the tail mount described above and they appear to be missing i would like to see one, as i currently use the marshall crimp to deck feather for telem only. But having a female Gos on order for this season and wanting to use one of your tailgaurds - a plectrum system is the way to go as i see it more ideal to have the gaurd supported by both decks rather than the spring clip to one but my main concern is losing decks with the plectrum mount, so any photos of the described set up in the "quote" above would be much appreciated.
Many Thanks In Advance Dave

[OutFlying]

Hi Jim i have looked thru this thread for pictures of the tail mount described above and they appear to be missing i would like to see one, as i currently use the marshall crimp to deck feather for telem only. But having a female Gos on order for this season and wanting to use one of your tailgaurds - a plectrum system is the way to go as i see it more ideal to have the gaurd supported by both decks rather than the spring clip to one but my main concern is losing decks with the plectrum mount, so any photos of the described set up in the "quote" above would be much appreciated.
Many Thanks In Advance Dave

I haven't got the photographs any more Dave, SpartheOne has done a thread showing all photographs.

Somebody better than me will find the thread hopefully.

Jim.

[Dangerous Dave]

Thanks Jim
found the said mount under Pimp my Spar, is there anywhere in particular you are buying the small cable ties from for fixing the bell?
Thanks Again Dave

[OutFlying]

Electrical suppliers, don't buy cheap ones - they need to be very flexible.

Jim.

[Dangerous Dave]

Brilliant, Nice one Jim!!!!!
Dave