Spike - 2007 Imprint Male Golden Eagle

[Salty]

thats a mint picture that ,they look class ABSOULUTELY CLASS and im not joshin ,how black does the eagle look ,realy black ,just wondering mate have you any cats in the house? wondering just for a start on fur pmsl:supz:

[Elly]

Best pics so far for me, really shows how big the weeman is!

[Salty]

just wondering neil ,he was hatched 22nd april and you picked him up on way back fromm ff ,did yous deffo know he was male then?just with the growth rate slower on a LARGE bird for a longer period sort of style ,or was it easy as hes bred many eagles ect ,im just curious or go by weight ect ,if im talking waffle just call me straight dude,thanks mate salty:supz:

[HuntersAll]

Spike at 48 days - He is next to a 27 day old female peregrine to give you an idea of size.


Fantastic pictures Neil,:supz: ,they're both growing apace..
I especially like the photo where something has caught there attention.
regards,
Tony..

[Berkut]

just wondering neil ,he was hatched 22nd april and you picked him up on way back fromm ff ,did yous deffo know he was male then?just with the growth rate slower on a LARGE bird for a longer period sort of style ,or was it easy as hes bred many eagles ect ,im just curious or go by weight ect ,if im talking waffle just call me straight dude,thanks mate salty:supz:

Salty,
He was dna'd before I got him.He initially grew quicker than all the other males before him and all bar one of the females.He has levelled out now and is about a pound lighter than Elsa was at the same age.
Neil.

[Berkut]

Have you been watching the Golden Eagle on the springwatch webcam Neil.
Was wondering how much difference you thought there was between that one and Spike in terms of development.

Paul

Haven't seen it Paul .I'll give it a look.

[PaulWar3]

Haven't seen it Paul .I'll give it a look.

Here's a link to there webcams Neil. But they have all different ones going so you have to time it right. The buzzard ones good aswell.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/nature/animals/springwatch/webcams/


Paul

[Kevin Massey]

Its like Danny and Arnie in twins:lol:

[Austringer84]

They were excellent fotos. thanks for sharing as always neil. bet your excited bout the comming season...so am i!

si

[SakerYZF]

Fantastic pictures Neil , both looking great :-D

[Rex06]

neil can you TRIE (don't bother to much) to take a picture of him when he is practising his wings and when someoneis next to him, cause i still have litle idee how big he is looks gigantic :lol: nice peregrine to fluffy ball
all awesome foto's here and the more, the better :)

[Berkut]

Rather than start a new thread I thought I would post a few pics of Vlad having a good bath.

[Berkut]

And a couple of Bentley after a bath and one of Spike today at 7 weeks.

[Hacker]

Neil,
i think we all enjoy a good bath in this weather!

[Berkut]

Neil,
i think we all enjoy a good bath in this weather!

I agree.Prefer not have photos taken though.( Unless the photographer is babetastic and topless.)

[Natch]

can,t weight till i pick up mine in 4 week,s time:supz:

[Berkut]

can,t weight till i pick up mine in 4 week,s time:supz:

Natch,
Who bred yours.

[Natch]

Natch,
Who bred yours.i will find out .......... my mate is doing all the sorting out ,,,he is getting a female:supz:

[Berkutchi]

The gold on Spike's neck is just starting to come through. I bet the contrast with the near black body feathers will be something.

http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s107/Berkutchi/spikenape.jpg

--Lauren

[Berkut]

i will find out .......... my mate is doing all the sorting out ,,,he is getting a female:supz:

Let me know how you go.All the best in any case,
Neil.

[RedNoseK9]

Neil do u find that the sun bleaches the feathers quite quickly on a goldie

[Berkut]

Neil do u find that the sun bleaches the feathers quite quickly on a goldie

Yes.Bentley was very dark and his feathers were well bleached during his first moult.

[Natch]

Let me know how you go.All the best in any case,
Neil.will do neil ,,,,i will be on the phone,,to u for some advice,,,,,,,,natch

[RedNoseK9]

Yes i thought as much because the change can be noticed in a week of sun

[Elly]

Neil, how are Vlad and Bentley moulting? Many feathers dropped yet? They look great in the pics anyway, and the close up of Spikes head is wicked. He'll be quite a looker i think. 8-)

[Berkut]

Neil, how are Vlad and Bentley moulting? Many feathers dropped yet? They look great in the pics anyway, and the close up of Spikes head is wicked. He'll be quite a looker i think. 8-)

Elly,
Vlad has dropped 5 tail feathers and 2 pairs of primaries.He is very relaxed so I am hoping to get him feather perfect again. He damaged a few feathers between leaving Austria and arriving in Scotland.
Bentley damaged one tail feather on the night after you had been out with me by pulling at telemetry.It has been moulted and is nearly fully down. He had one broken primary which he did on a hare.It has been moulted along with the matching one and he has also dropped a pair of outer tail feathers.
Cinnibar is moutling well but is still tender around the areas of the wing that were injured before I got her back. All in all they are looking good.

Spike is 49 days today and weighed in at 7 lbs 13.5 oz with a small amount of food in his crop. His appetite has picked up again and he fills his crop twice a day with snacks in between.

Neil.

[Salty]

Salty,
He was dna'd before I got him.He initially grew quicker than all the other males before him and all bar one of the females.He has levelled out now and is about a pound lighter than Elsa was at the same age.
Neil.thanks for that dude ,great thread youl be busy this season coming my mate ,lookin forward to reading about it ,you shud make a vid of hunting eagles mate it wud be first class mate ,salty:supz:

[Berkut]

thanks for that dude ,great thread youl be busy this season coming my mate ,lookin forward to reading about it ,you shud make a vid of hunting eagles mate it wud be first class mate ,salty:supz:

I'm a step ahead of you. ;)

[Salty]

I'm a step ahead of you. ;)
well im pleased to hear it mate ,i would be first in line amongst the many to see it first hand and real and purchase a one , without a doubt mate ,:supz:

[Austringer84]

Excited about your video neil. please keep us posted. any hints on content and when ready?

si

[Berkut]

Spike today at 51 days.

[GriffMJ]

Spike today at 51 days.


Feathers come on really quickly!! :shock: Very dark Neil.... bet your chuffed with the colour.

[Isis]

Looking good :supz:

Looking more like some sort of vulture 8-)

[Richard]

As always, great pics

[RedNoseK9]

Look great now mate

Cant wait to see him going mate

wez

[FredrickFogg]

Neil,

Can you put sunscreen on his feathers or keep an umbrella over him while you are hunting him? LOL I just hate to see the sun make his feathers lighten up, they are so dark. He is going to really be beautiful! :supz: Make sure you get lots of pictures of him this dark before the sun does it thing when you start hunting him, most people won't believe how dark he is now and you will have the photo's to prove it.

Fred

[Eagle Owl]

:shock: :shock: Holy **** he sure has feathered out!!! And he is so darn dark...absolutely gorgeous color:supz: He is just awesome Neil!!!!

And I want a video, too;)

[Yeoman]

looking good neil

[Austringer84]

Spike today at 51 days.

Feathers come on really quickly!! :shock: Very dark Neil.... bet your chuffed with the colour.

Blimey that spike has come on in leaps and bounds in terms of feathers, so pleased for you. and i love how dark he is, eagle heights had one they were gonna hunt with that was similarly dark, dont know what happened to it, but it looked awsome. as does spike. and i cant wait to see him change and progress.

cheers neil

si

[Greg]

Looking really good Neil, will have to see this guy one of theses days. He really is very dark, it will be inteesting to compare these pictures with the ones you take throughout the season.
By the way nice to see you are getting him used to everday things like Bill and Ben! Could come in useful if they happen to hike across the moor!

[Palmer]

Think you should change his name back to Taurus, I rekon he'll be as strong as a bull:yawinkle:

but im in love with him mate, he's looking awsome:supz:

[Berkut]

Here are some pictures taken a few minutes ago of Spike. I won't be posting much in the near future so they will be the last for a while. The forum isn't what it once was for me so apart from reading the odd pm here and there that will be about it from me. If I go to the festival I will hopefully catch up with some of you there.
Regards,
Neil.

[Claire]

Neil has requested this thread is reopened so that he can ad to it.
please keep it on topic

[OutFlying]

Hello Neil,
Can you provide an outline of the training to come and likely timescales ?


Jim.

[Berkut]

Thanks Claire. Agreed. My gripes lie elsewhere. Why should those who follow this thread miss out.

Here he is at 56 days. Feeds from carcasses exclusively now. I have fitted anklets in the last 20 minutes and it is now raining so I will take a picture with them on later. Haven't weighed him for a few days now as it can be awkward, as he is not steady enough to stand on the scales and difficult to get into a bowl or tray.

Standard male anklets are slightly tight so I may have to try slightly larger ones.

[LanczSpringer]

He's looking great Neil!

Very dark :supz:

[Elly]

Very glad this thread has been reopened. :D

[Berkut]

Hello Neil,
Can you provide an outline of the training to come and likely timescales ?


Jim.

Jim,
It is my intention to give him 2 - 4 hours tame hacking per day starting in the next 2 weeks as he becomes mobile. He should pen in 4 weeks. I will be changing him to 2 feeds per day very soon and this will be reduced to either I feed per day come penning or a snack in the morning and his main feed at night.I hope at this stage minimum weight reduction will be required and his appetite will keep him close at feeding time. He still has no idea I supply the food. The ultimate goal is to have him killing soon after penning.
Neil.

[TimDog80]

neil,
great to see your thread back up and running mate:goodman: , sure many agree?, he's looking stunning now mate!!!!!

best of luck with him
tim:D

[OutFlying]

Jim,
It is my intention to give him 2 - 4 hours tame hacking per day starting in the next 2 weeks as he becomes mobile. He should pen in 4 weeks. I will be changing him to 2 feeds per day very soon and this will be reduced to either I feed per day come penning or a snack in the morning and his main feed at night.I hope at this stage minimum weight reduction will be required and his appetite will keep him close at feeding time. He still has no idea I supply the food. The ultimate goal is to have him killing soon after penning.
Neil.


How will you introduce the recall and still try to prevent the food association ? I intend to try something different this time.

Jim.

[Berkut]

How will you introduce the recall and still try to prevent the food association ? I intend to try something different this time.

Jim.

Not worked that out as yet Jim. We could maybe bounce a few ideas about as and when they spring to mind if that's ok,

[Matthew Patching]

He is looking great neil.

I bet you cant wait for that first flight, and I hope everything geos well, with the tame hack.

[Cyclone]

aint been on for a while and omg how much has he changed!! very dark hes a stunner mate!
Shane

[Austringer84]

Great to see the thread re-opened. cant wait to see bits bout him hacking.

si

[OutFlying]

Not worked that out as yet Jim. We could maybe bounce a few ideas about as and when they spring to mind if that's ok,


No problem Neil,
I intend to lure train away from the glove using a third party, unlike the usual recall towards oneself.

Seems pointless to go to all the trouble of hiding the food supply for weeks and then suddenly start to produce the food before hunting success produces maturity and independance - this problem was highlighted with my first imprint.

Jim.

ps It might not make the slightest difference but will try it myself this season.

[RedNoseK9]

Im glad you are trying this jim as i have a few things that i would do different if i was doing another and this was my first that i thought of so really excited to see how it pans out mate

wez

[Berkut]

No problem Neil,
I intend to lure train away from the glove using a third party, unlike the usual recall towards oneself.

Seems pointless to go to all the trouble of hiding the food supply for weeks and then suddenly start to produce the food before hunting success produces maturity and independance - this problem was highlighted with my first imprint.

Jim.

ps It might not make the slightest difference but will try it myself this season.

Jim,
Makes good sense to me.
Neil.

[Berkut]

Managed to get the boy weighed - 56 days - 8 lb 1 oz. :shock: :shock:

[Salty]

Managed to get the boy weighed - 56 days - 8 lb 1 oz. :shock: :shock:
cushty mate ,keep the good stuff coming and on spikes plate :goodman: :lol:

[Matthew Patching]

Managed to get the boy weighed - 56 days - 8 lb 1 oz. :shock: :shock:

Fat little ****er then!:supz:

[FredrickFogg]

Neil,

I haven't been on for over a week, and I don't even want to read back to see why you thought about closing this thread! I am just glad you decided to continue it. Spike is looking great and everytime I get on, I come to check to see what has been posted. Never worked with an eagle, probably never will, but I can honestly say, everything I learn about every type of bird is going to be helpful in the long run. Keep up the great work and please keep us posted of what you are doing and why? I, among others, really appreciate anyone that runs a thread through the entire training of a bird.

Thanks,
Fred

[Matthew Patching]

Neil,

I haven't been on for over a week, and I don't even want to read back to see why you thought about closing this thread! I am just glad you decided to continue it. Spike is looking great and everytime I get on, I come to check to see what has been posted. Never worked with an eagle, probably never will, but I can honestly say, everything I learn about every type of bird is going to be helpful in the long run. Keep up the great work and please keep us posted of what you are doing and why? I, among others, really appreciate anyone that runs a thread through the entire training of a bird.

Thanks,
Fred

Well said, and keep up the good work neil!:supz:

[Berkut]

I gave Spike the run of the garden for a couple of hours tonight.He chose his preferred perch.

[1ABHawker]

Managed to get the boy weighed - 56 days - 8 lb 1 oz. :shock: :shock:

BLIMEY! Don't think i could afford to feed it!

[Rusty83]

he's a beaut neil lovely and dark!!
stunning!!

Russ

[JoHo]

Keep up the good work Neil.

Hope to see lots more.

[Kentish Falconry]

You sure he's not half Black Eagle Neil? :lol: :lol:

[Kevin Massey]

You sure he's not half Black Eagle Neil? :lol: :lol:


I asked the same a while back Terry... no reply:roll: :D

[Pendleside]

neil .

what will you enter him on and how will you go about setting up a flight in his favour ?

pete.

[Harrisii]

No problem Neil,
I intend to lure train away from the glove using a third party, unlike the usual recall towards oneself.

Seems pointless to go to all the trouble of hiding the food supply for weeks and then suddenly start to produce the food before hunting success produces maturity and independance - this problem was highlighted with my first imprint.

Jim.

ps It might not make the slightest difference but will try it myself this season.

"different level" FALCONRY, great Qs, great thread and a true learning curve for all looking in.

fantastic pics, great reading and one great thread in all.

hope you keep up posting Neil, i ken how you feel about this forum and its patrons from time to time, some i am truely looking to grind.

but the truth must spill out and your posts, pics and diary are a welcome bonus and pleasure to a great many. all the best and please keep the diary going as its an inspirstion and pleasure to many.

all the very best, H.

[Berkut]

neil .

what will you enter him on and how will you go about setting up a flight in his favour ?

pete.

Pete,
I am hoping he will be ready to chase around hard penning.The plan is to flush leverets for him. Hopefully he be doing a bit of flying at tame hack around then to.
Neil.

[Berkut]

Not posted for a few days as I have had a lot on. As part of the process Spike has gone to a friends for a week. Tom (TLB ) will no doubt give a couple of updates and post some photographs before I get him back at the end of the week.
Neil.

[Austringer84]

is that part of the process to avoid him being too imprinted on you and your residence?!

si

[Berkut]

is that part of the process to avoid him being too imprinted on you and your residence?!

si

Si,
Yes,It's good to move him around a bit. Although I have just picked him back up. Before he left me on Saturday he took a tumble from the nest. Looked like he had given himself a knock. It worsened overnight last night so I took him to the vets today. I just got back. No fractures ,it looks like he has pulled a muscle so he is feeling sorry for himself at the moment.
Neil

[JoHo]

Real sorry to hear that Neil,
Hope it doesn't set him back at all.

Johann

[OutFlying]

Neil,
Do you house the young imprint in your house or outdoors ?

Jim.

[LadyHawke]

I'm sory to hear that, Niel. I hope the wee fella feels better soon. Pictures are great - he's so dark!

[Berkut]

Neil,
Do you house the young imprint in your house or outdoors ?

Jim.

Jim,
A bit of both. He is out overnight now though.
Neil.

[Berkut]

I'm sory to hear that, Niel. I hope the wee fella feels better soon. Pictures are great - he's so dark!

Thanks Alison. Hopefully a few days rest and he'll be right as rain.

[Andy_G]

just took me hours to read this and again berkut a great thread and yes hope he is on the mend asap

and i will old u to ur word when i feel im ready for a eagle i will get ur help etc etc


again superb thread

[SteveL]

Hi neil, nice pics of spike he's coming on leaps and bounds now goodstuff.:supz:

[TLDWB]

Hi neil, nice pics of spike he's coming on leaps and bounds now goodstuff.:supz:

Thats just what caused all the trouble in the first place:yawinkle:

Tom

[Berkut]

A couple of photos of Spike today at 66 days.

Things have taken a real setback with his leg injury. I got a call from the vets today to say the radiologist had taken a good look at the x-rays and there is a lack of clarity round one of the joints. If there is a slight fracture it won't show for a couple of weeks , so he may have to be x-rayed again or they may have to carry out a ct scan. Regardless of all that he is a sorry sight hobbling around, as he can put no weight on the leg at all. If the further examinations still show no fractures there could be tendon damage.

I am on a real downer because of it at the moment and just hope he's ok.

[TimDog80]

really sorry to hear that neil:( ......i hope he come right for you soon!!!

best regards
tim

[OutFlying]

Good luck Neil,
I hope the vet treatment doesn't upset him and spoil some of the hard work you've put in.

Yours Jim.

[JoHo]

Hi Neil,

really sorry about that, :cry: :cry: hope he heals soon. Are we still seeing your at the fair on Sat? Would love to meet you and hear all about it.

Johann.

[Palmer]

Very sorry to hear this Neil, things are on abit of a downer lately, but on the bright side, things can only get better! Keep your chin up mate

[Berkut]

Good luck Neil,
I hope the vet treatment doesn't upset him and spoil some of the hard work you've put in.

Yours Jim.

Jim,
It is amazing how these particular vets , good though they are, have no concept of the imprinting process. I nearly fell out with them yesterday and will have to put the foot down as to the handling prior to anaesthetic if they have to x-ray him again. I see a few sleepless nights ahead unfortunately.
Thanks,
Neil.

[Berkut]

Hi Neil,

really sorry about that, :cry: :cry: hope he heals soon. Are we still seeing your at the fair on Sat? Would love to meet you and hear all about it.

Johann.

I am going up on Friday.Will you be there then.
Neil.

[Berkut]

really sorry to hear that neil:( ......i hope he come right for you soon!!!

best regards
tim

Very sorry to hear this Neil, things are on abit of a downer lately, but on the bright side, things can only get better! Keep your chin up mate

Cheers Tim and Ed.

[OutFlying]

Jim,
It is amazing how these particular vets , good though they are, have no concept of the imprinting process. I nearly fell out with them yesterday and will have to put the foot down as to the handling prior to anaesthetic if they have to x-ray him again. I see a few sleepless nights ahead unfortunately.
Thanks,
Neil.

I know exactly what you mean Neil,
Similar experiences with "an avian" specialist vet that man handled an imprint as you would a parent reared hawk, no thought.

Jim.

[Pearl]

bloody hell mate im gutted for you hope all is ok and all goes well at the vets chin up mate :yawinkle:

[Eagle Owl]

Oh Neil, I am so sorry to hear that:( I am wishing you the best and hope Spike make a full recovery!!! Things will get better...keep your chin up:smile:

[Matthew Patching]

So sorry to hear that neil, I hope that things get better soon, he looks so stunning, I hope that he is ok, and that you are ok aswell!

[Bones]

Sorry to hear of this bad news mate but im sure all will come good in the end so fingers crossed for you mate

PAUL

[Rab Marshall]

hope all works out for you and ur eagles,rab

[Mark Collins]

Good luck with him neil, mark.

[ParaButeo78]

A couple of photos of Spike today at 66 days.

Things have taken a real setback with his leg injury. I got a call from the vets today to say the radiologist had taken a good look at the x-rays and there is a lack of clarity round one of the joints. If there is a slight fracture it won't show for a couple of weeks , so he may have to be x-rayed again or they may have to carry out a ct scan. Regardless of all that he is a sorry sight hobbling around, as he can put no weight on the leg at all. If the further examinations still show no fractures there could be tendon damage.

I am on a real downer because of it at the moment and just hope he's ok.

It just won't end for you, Neil.
Real sorry for you and Spike.
I hope everything will be allright and the vets don't traumatize him.

[Ned]

neil hope spike`s ok,one of the darkest plumages i`ve seen on an eagle atb ned.

[Richard]

Hope things pick up Neil, keep your chin up...

[Berkut]

Thanks for the good wishes.Fingers crossed.

[JoHo]

I can't go both days :( just Sat
I just finished reading you thread on Elsa (took quite some time), and after going through all that, knowing how much you have looked forward to getting it right with Spike, this must be a hard blow. Hope all turn out well

[SteveL]

Sorry to hear about spike just as things come on great something stops it in its tracks.hope he gets well soon, he's looking great nice dark chocolate colour, enjoy the fair.:supz:

[GosFlyer]

just picked up on the thread again m8, sorry to hear spike has knocked himself up a wee bit, hope all turns out ok for him, he was coming on so good too. good luck.

[Gary F]

just picked up thread, f hell mate your not having much luck latley,
fingers crossed for spike, and hows cinnibar?
gary

[ReluctantTwitcher]

What a downer, Neil! (And yet another one at that...:()
I sincerely hope he picks up where he left off, he appeared
to be coming along so well. Hopefully, it'll turn out to be a
sprained joint without any fractures or tendon damage.
I used to train gymnastics (mostly floor & trampoline) some
10-15 hours a week in my younger days, and had my fair
share of painful landings causing both sprains and muscle
ruptures, and was the same as Spike afterwards at times.
Survived without any major long-term injuries in the end
though! :wink: Best wishes, however it may go.

Cheers,
/Magnus

[Hardcore Hawker]

Hope things work out for the best Neil. He could not be in better hands.

[Lady]

Hope he's soon fully recovered. It's one thing after another at the moment, isn't it?

[AngelJakki]

Hope everything works out ok. Really seems like 2007 is a year to forget for most people I know.:(

[Elly]

Rough time at the minute to say the least, they do say when it rains it pours. I really hope the weeman comes up good with no serious damage and no further upset at the vets. Chin up, fingers crossed he'll be back on his feet and stomping around in no time.

[PaulWar3]

Jeez Neil,
Just caught up on the thread. If you did'nt have bad luck you would'nt have any luck at all. Im sure with plenty of TLC Both Spike and Cinnibar will soon be back to full health.:supz:

Paul

[Gyr]

Hi neil, just catching up with threads, hope everything turns out ok m8. kerry.

[Berkut]

Don't want to tempt fate too much ,so I am touching wood at the moment ,but I am starting to see a slight improvement in Spikes leg injury. He is able to put his weight on it again ,albeit gingerley, and is back on carcasses again.

I will try and post some photos tomorrow . Things have been a bit hectic laterly as I am helping out a couple of mates with the imprinting of their gosses and I am preparing to pick up my potential gull hawks of the season on Monday.
Neil.

[TimDog80]

Don't want to tempt fate too much ,so I am touching wood at the moment ,but I am starting to see a slight improvement in Spikes leg injury. He is able to put his weight on it again ,albeit gingerley, and is back on carcasses again.

I will try and post some photos tomorrow . Things have been a bit hectic laterly as I am helping out a couple of mates with the imprinting of their gosses and I am preparing to pick up my potential gull hawks of the season on Monday.
Neil.
great news neil:supz: ........... if he comes around in time are you gonna reconsider taking him to the festival?


best regards
tim:D

[Berkut]

great news neil:supz: ........... if he comes around in time are you gonna reconsider taking him to the festival?


best regards
tim:D

I probably would take him if he shows a big improvement Tim.

[Palmer]

I probably would take him if he shows a big improvement Tim.

Neil do you still want to stay at myn?

[Berkut]

Neil do you still want to stay at myn?

If I get down that would be ideal , although I have a few more obstacles to overcome before I know if I will make it.
Thanks again,
Neil.

[Palmer]

If I get down that would be ideal , although I have a few more obstacles to overcome before I know if I will make it.
Thanks again,
Neil.

Ok mate glad to hear Both Spike and Cinnibar seem to be getting better by the day!:supz:

Keep the good work up bud! Ed

[LongVVing]

Double bubble I hope for you. Great to hear an improvement in Spike aswell as Cinnibar. They are both in the best place for a recovery. Fingers crossed with the re-xrays of him at the next vet visit.

He is very dark and that golden head is gonna be a contrast and really stand out!

ATB,

Mark.

[Berkut]

Double bubble I hope for you. Great to hear an improvement in Spike aswell as Cinnibar. They are both in the best place for a recovery. Fingers crossed with the re-xrays of him at the next vet visit.

He is very dark and that golden head is gonna be a contrast and really stand out!

ATB,

Mark.

Mark,
He is as dark as I have seen which was as I hoped. That particular female always throws dark youngsters. If he continues to improve I will forget the re-xrays but once healed he will have to go and stay with someone else for a month or so as he is showing me some resentment at the moment. I think it may be due to the fact I was there and tried to prevent his tumble from the nest ledge.He may associate me with the pain he felt. Fingers still crossed but unfortunately it has put my tame hacking on hold, which I was really looking forward to.
Thanks,
Neil.

[Dude]

Fingers crossed for ur bird Neil! Hope things turn out in a good way!

Dan.

[B C]

I've just caught up with this thread Neil and didn't know about Spike's accident. Wish you all the best for a speedy and full recovery on both Eagles.

Bernie

[Benny H]

Sorry to hear about the little fella Neil..:supz: to a speedy recovery.

[RedNoseK9]

Really glada about the improvement neil and hope to see at festival mate

Wez

[Matthew Patching]

Good to hear that he appears to be improving, I hope this continues, and would not like to think what worries you have had with both birds over the last few weeks. There may be light at the end of the tunnel, good luck neil.

[Berkut]

Good to hear that he appears to be improving, I hope this continues, and would not like to think what worries you have had with both birds over the last few weeks. There may be light at the end of the tunnel, good luck neil.

Thanks very much Matt.

[Berkut]

A few of him today at 70 days.Standing on the leg more but hobbling when he has to walk.

[Pearl]

very nice neil mate does he call at all :yawinkle:

[Berkut]

very nice neil mate does he call at all :yawinkle:

I have to say he makes a rather irritating noise as he seems to resent me at the moment ,but he is not vocal as such.

[Pearl]

do you think he will call as he gets older mate as most goldies ive seen do and wondered if by imprinting it made it worse sorry for the questions mate 8-)

[GyrXPeales]

Man Neil, as you know I've been off line for a few weeks. I'm so sorry to hear about the Spikester. Glad to hear he's doing better though brother.
You and Spike will be in our prayers.
My very best regards,
Jeff
Glad to see Cinnabar back home too mate!!

[Berkut]

Man Neil, as you know I've been off line for a few weeks. I'm so sorry to hear about the Spikester. Glad to hear he's doing better though brother.
You and Spike will be in our prayers.
My very best regards,
Jeff
Glad to see Cinnabar back home too mate!!

Cheers Jeff. Hope all is well with you.

[Matthew Patching]

Jesus, how black is he!

I hadnt realised just how dark he was, even after looking at the other fotos, the latest ones realy do show just how dark he is. Id be chuffed to bits!

Have you managed to get a weight on him, or have you been leaving off while he is recovering. Its good that he is back on carcasses, as he will be able to take out any pent up aggression out on them, rather than you lol!:supz:

[Berkut]

Jesus, how black is he!

I hadnt realised just how dark he was, even after looking at the other fotos, the latest ones realy do show just how dark he is. Id be chuffed to bits!

Have you managed to get a weight on him, or have you been leaving off while he is recovering. Its good that he is back on carcasses, as he will be able to take out any pent up aggression out on them, rather than you lol!:supz:

Matt,
He is really dark.The last time I weighed him was 2 weeks ago and he was 8lbs 1 oz. The injury has been a real setback as I would have been walking with him on the fist a lot now and I was intending tame hacking him 3 or 4 hours a day. I am chuffed with him but I will be lot happier when I see a real improvement in the leg. He will have to go elsewhere for a month or so once he has fully recovered as he seems to resent me at the moment.
No aggression towards me though so far which pleases me.
Neil.

[Pearl]

was he bred y anb neil :yawinkle:

[Berkut]

was he bred y anb neil :yawinkle:

Yes he was mate.From a very dark female.

[Pearl]

Yes he was mate.From a very dark female.i was at his place a few years back to pick up a male he was black as soot mate i think the mother was passion and the farther was gorby :supz:

[Berkut]

i was at his place a few years back to pick up a male he was black as soot mate i think the mother was passion and the farther was gorby :supz:

That is the same mother but Spikes father was Talin. I saw a Passion/ Gorby chick a couple of years ago and it was a cracker.

[Pearl]

That is the same mother but Spikes father was Talin. I saw a Passion/ Gorby chick a couple of years ago and it was a cracker.i had my female from them parents she was going black in her 2nd year

[TLDWB]

Glad to hear that he's improving, will he be paying a visit back here?

Tom

[Berkut]

Glad to hear that he's improving, will he be paying a visit back here?

Tom

That's the plan if it is still ok with you. ;)

[Berkut]

i had my female from them parents she was going black in her 2nd year

V nice. :cool:

[TLDWB]

That's the plan if it is still ok with you. ;)

Yep, pleasure

Tom

[Berkut]

Big improvement in Spike on a daily basis at the moment. He stood on his bad leg yesterday and scratched his head with the good foot and then swapped over. He was footing a quail carcass with the bad foot this morning, so things are looking up. A couple of photographs just taken at 73 days.
Neil.

[Benny H]

Looking good Neil,,:supz: :supz:

[PaulWar3]

Glad to see hes on the mend Neil:supz:

Paul

[Matthew Patching]

Very pleased for you and him neil!:supz:

[Joey]

havent had a look at the thread for ages niel mate what a difference top stuff mate keep up the great work what a stunner robber the pic too



joey

[Isis]

Good to hear hes on the mend Neil......:supz:

[Mark Collins]

Sounds like he is on the mend, good , worrying time , i had it with this f.peregrine recently with a wing problem, good luck with him neil, cheers, mark.

[Berkut]

Sounds like he is on the mend, good , worrying time , i had it with this f.peregrine recently with a wing problem, good luck with him neil, cheers, mark.

Cheers Mark.I've had a few sleepless nights. Hopefully be 100% soon.
All the best,
Neil.

[TimDog80]

Big improvement in Spike on a daily basis at the moment. He stood on his bad leg yesterday and scratched his head with the good foot and then swapped over. He was footing a quail carcass with the bad foot this morning, so things are looking up. A couple of photographs just taken at 73 days.
Neil.
a welcome releif for you then neil......... nice to see your back on track with him mate:supz:


all the best
tim:D

[Ned]

glad theres been an improvement neil,atb ned.

[Austringer84]

Glad to hear he's improving. best of luck mate.

si

[B C]

Told you all would be well Neil - glad to hear it!!

Bernie

[GosHawking2Day]

Really pleased to see the "little" fella on the mend, best of luck.
ATB

[Berkut]

Spike shows a steady,daily improvement. I am between a rock and a hard place as he should really be tethered now but I daren't incase he hurts his leg again.

Funny thing happened today though , very much like last year with Elsa ,he aggressively postured at me for no apparent reason and when it came to the daily hooding he was having none of it.
I gave him half an hour and went back and he turned his back on me again and raised his hackles.
I went in like nothing had happened,stepped him up on the fist and as I walked with him,popped the hood on without much trouble.
This virtually mirrors what happened with Elsa at around the same age.

[JoHo]

Mhhh, that's not really a good thing is it :(
Well you recon Elsa turned out ok for Tom, so maybe Spike will not show that aggression if he comes to live up here with me ;) ;)

Yeah right,

Do you think its still the resentment of the fall. Or could it be the same problem as with Elsa??

[Berkut]

Mhhh, that's not really a good thing is it :(
Well you recon Elsa turned out ok for Tom, so maybe Spike will not show that aggression if he comes to live up here with me ;) ;)

Yeah right,

Do you think its still the resentment of the fall. Or could it be the same problem as with Elsa??

I think it is sibling rivalry ,with me as the sibling. It is too similar in timing and the way it happened to be anything else. The thing is with Elsa it got progressively worse , yet she was a pussycat with Tom and remained that way.

[JoHo]

Like I said I am sure I can make space for him ;)

[Berkut]

Spike now 78 days. His leg is just about 100 % ,which is good as he needs tethering soon. His aggression and stropps continue,in fact,if he hadn't been dna'd twice as a male I'd have said he was female.:lol:

Hooding is good,anklets back on today and I may go down the tame hacking route as planned.

A couple of photos of him enjoying the fine weather today.

[Sarah J]

Looks like pic no. 3 was a hard day at the office :yawinkle: :heart:

[TimDog80]

top news neil:supz: :supz:
how active is he now then neil as i just had visions about a bit of wind getting under his wings and you having to go garden hopping to try and get him back:lol: :yawinkle:


good to hear!!!
tim

[B C]

He's looking good now Neil, no doubt he will be after those Hares with the rest of the team by the end of the year!

Bernie

[Berkut]

Some of my favourites showing how he has come on.

[Berkut]

And more

[TLDWB]

Good news, hope to see him next week;)

Tom

[Gary F]

good news, he looks great, mike tomkies looks overjoyed having on his lap

[GyrXPeales]

That's great news Neil. I'm looking forward to the possibility of you tame hacking this bird with great anticipation, it feels right to me, and it might be just be what the lad needs. Here's to the great experiment.:supz:
He's lookin' great Neil.
My best as always,
Jeff

Spike now 78 days. His leg is just about 100 % ,which is good as he needs tethering soon. His aggression and stropps continue,in fact,if he hadn't been dna'd twice as a male I'd have said he was female.:lol:

Hooding is good,anklets back on today and I may go down the tame hacking route as planned.

A couple of photos of him enjoying the fine weather today.

[Berkut]

top news neil:supz: :supz:
how active is he now then neil as i just had visions about a bit of wind getting under his wings and you having to go garden hopping to try and get him back:lol: :yawinkle:


good to hear!!!
tim

He's just about at that stage Tim. I need to give the leg a few days yet before he can be tethered.

[Berkut]

I'll need to try and weigh him.Last time was at 56 days and he was just over 8 lbs. Standard male hood is a bit tight and standard female slightly loose, so I'll have to go somewhere in between.

[Berkut]

He's looking good now Neil, no doubt he will be after those Hares with the rest of the team by the end of the year!

Bernie


I hope so Bernie

That's great news Neil. I'm looking forward to the possibility of you tame hacking this bird with great anticipation, it feels right to me, and it might be just be what the lad needs. Here's to the great experiment.:supz:
He's lookin' great Neil.
My best as always,
Jeff

Cheers Jeff. It has been a process with many ups and downs. I had the "Angel Wing " problem initially which was quickly rectified and the leg injury was a real bummer. I have enjoyed watching him develope but as usual that part of it is over all to quickly for my liking. It seems like yesterday Lauren and I picked him up as a ball of fluff and already he is just about to take his first flight.

Neil

[Berkut]

good news, he looks great, mike tomkies looks overjoyed having on his lap

That was one of the highlights for me and Mike as it turned out.

[Alan G]

From a cute fluff ball or an extra from Ice Age (Sid lookalike) to a Majestic looking youngster.

Stunning Neil, its a pleasure to have watched the transformation and look forward to following Spike's progress.

ATB

Alan.

[JoHo]

He is a real stunner mate,

Hope he gets over this aggression thing soon, and hope you have no more setbacks, carry on the cracking job. ATB
Johann

[Austringer84]

Hope all continues to go well mate.

cant wair to hear of your hunting sessions.

si

[Pendleside]

neil .

so whats the next stage ?
will you give him a try at tame hack and try to overcome the aggression or will he be going on his holidays ?
if you do decide to send him away how long will he be gone or will you just play it by ear and monitor the aggression with regular visits ?

pete.

[Palmer]

He looks like a complete stunner, and great to here about his leg!:supz:

[Berkut]

Spike took a real interest in water for the first time today so I put out a bath for him. It was only falcon size but he had a great time.

[Berkut]

Fitted him with new anklets and jesses today. Going to speak to the vet for advice regarding tethering. I will also have to start travelling him in a box as he is becoming very restless in the back of the truck.

[Berkut]

neil .

so whats the next stage ?
will you give him a try at tame hack and try to overcome the aggression or will he be going on his holidays ?
if you do decide to send him away how long will he be gone or will you just play it by ear and monitor the aggression with regular visits ?

pete.

Pete,
I'll try the tame hack over the next few days and see how it goes. Could end up away his holidays for a week or two.
The funny thing about the aggression is he seems to switch it on and off like a light. Elsa was the same.

[Gram]

Is there no patern to the aggresion Neil? times,places,the way you approach ect

[Matthew Patching]

He looks great Neil.

Juvenile eagles in the wild show huge amounts of parental agression just prior and just post fledging, it could be somthing to do with this.

Perhaps sending him away for a few weeks while he gets over it, may be the way forward.

I am glad that his leg appears to be healed, and I hope after all the heart ache everything turns out as you had hoped.

ATB

Matt.

[Berkut]

I had to bite the bullet and tether Spike today.While I was sorting all the birds this morning,he jumped off the nest ledge , over a 4 ft fence and arrived on the driveway of the house.He was obviously looking for me as he ran towards me and sat at my feet as soon as he saw me. I used an elasticated leash for the time being to ease the strain on his leg,although his bates are not to vigorous at the moment.

[Nemesis]

hi neil first time I have had a look for a while what a cracker he has turned out to be you must be well pleased /dave

[ReluctantTwitcher]

Hi Neil,

Well, even though he's tethered, he looks quite pleased with himself just sitting on that fabulous block! (Seems like he likes his bath too 8-))
Fingers crossed, he won't harm himself bating away from it. I guess he just has to get used to the idea of being a bit more stationary for
the time being. Tame-hacking him sounds like a great idea btw. I bet it'll make him less bound to bate and/or struggle the jesses if he's
allowed to work out on the "Wind Mill" on a regular basis.

All the best,
/Magnus


PS. What's the diameter of the block he's sitting on? Would be nice to know,
if not then just for us viewers to get an idea of the spread of his awesome "spikes". ;)

[PaulWar3]

Wow He looks fantastic.:supz: Love the photo in the top right.
Did you take him to the festival Neil? and if so how did he handle all the extra people and the travelling?

Paul

[Berkut]

Wow He looks fantastic.:supz: Love the photo in the top right.
Did you take him to the festival Neil? and if so how did he handle all the extra people and the travelling?

Paul


Paul ,
I never took him to the festival. I was glad really as it was very warm and the goldies I saw were quite stressed .They were getting passed around from pillar to post. I am hoping to get him out for a few hours a day at tame hack in the next week so if that comes off I will post a few photos of him.

Neil.

[Matthew Patching]

Hi Neil, Was nice to meet you yesterday, and I hope that the tame hacking goes well, atb Matt.:D

[Berkut]

Hi Neil, Was nice to meet you yesterday, and I hope that the tame hacking goes well, atb Matt.:D

Likewise Matt.It was a pity we couldn't have spoken for longer when we share so much common ground. I'll keep you posted and hopefully catch up again some time.
All the best,
Neil.

[jason]

This an amazing tread.

Ive just red it from page one,

You must be so proud and its easy to see that its a low and highs of life experience the comittment falconers have is unquestionable,

Spike clearly is an amazing bird and as tempremental as he maybe at times im sure you will master him yourself and he will grow to be an amazing testomany to you and your efforts .

I can only read in Orr on your achievements comittment and skill.

Jason

[White Sea Eagle]

wow what a great thread, first time i,ve read it. He's a real stunner. Glad spike's ok from his injury.

[Berkut]

A quick update , Spikes leg appears to be completely healed now. Had hoped to get him out for a few hours today but with work committments and Cinnibar at the vets for a follow up visit it wasn't possible. I'll try him tomorrow. His aggression continues very much in the same way as Elsa's did last year , so we'll just have to see how it goes.
I'll take some photos later and post them.
Neil.

[Palmer]

Neil im glad Spike's recoverd!

Now fingur's crossed for some tame hack and Let's hope Cinibar get's better soon!:supz:

Regards Ed

[Gram]

Shame he didnt make it to the festival Neil but at least he is on the way to full recovery along with cinnibar

[Berkut]

Here he is today at 85 days enjoying the sun.He had a really good half hour bath earlier.

[Paddy1]

looking good neil in what way is he agressive towards you is it when you approach him or pick him up ?????

[Quiver]

he is looking good neil, nice swivel too:yawinkle: :yawinkle:

chris.

[Berkut]

looking good neil in what way is he agressive towards you is it when you approach him or pick him up ?????

Paddy,
There is no pattern to it. It is always totally out the blue. I feed him in different places every day now. Last night I was lying on my back enjoying the sun while he had his meal. All of a sudden he charged at me and landed on my chest. Luckily my moobs:lol: took the brunt of it. He was fine after that.

[Paddy1]

uuuum a weird one then could it not be a dominece thing ????

[Berkut]

uuuum a weird one then could it not be a dominece thing ????

I think it is a sibling rivalry thing.He has never seen me supply the food but has spent so much time with me he looks upon me as a brother rather than a parent. Elsa was exactly the same and look how she turned out. As far as imprint eagles go ,swap imprint is definately the way to go.

[JoHo]

Here he is today at 85 days enjoying the sun.He had a really good half hour bath earlier.

They always look so comical when they lay down like that. Cracks me up every time

[Hardcore Hawker]

Looking good Neil, not long now.

[Berkut]

Spikes leg injury put me 3 weeks behind schedule with my plans for him. Anyway I took him out for the last 3 hours and let him do his own thing. He didn't do much initially and really just familiarised himself with his surroundings.

[Sarah J]

Beautiful pics Mr Hunter :heart:

[Berkut]

After about an hour of looking around and preening the wind got quite strong and he seemed to enjoy it.

[Berkut]

After another hour and a lot of wing flapping he was off.

[Berkut]

He was looking for me and I shouted,he turned and came towards me. This is my favourite.

[Isis]

Top dollar m8..........:supz:

[Alf]

Neil you know how I feel regarding eagles but he is looking good mate must have a trip up this year to see them in action. Great photos. Alf.

[Berkut]

Neil you know how I feel regarding eagles but he is looking good mate must have a trip up this year to see them in action. Great photos. Alf.

Anytime Alf. You can carry the game bag.;)

[Alf]

**** that I know how much a hare weighs and I heard your eagles take a few in a day.:yawinkle:
Alf.

Anytime Alf. You can carry the game bag.;)

[Greg]

Looking great Neil!
Soon learn how to use the wind if he carries on like that!

[KiteTrainer]

He was looking for me and I shouted,he turned and came towards me. This is my favourite.

Now there is something you do not see every day, makes it worth all the effort, he's looking great

[Scarab]

That,s a beauty! i hope everYthing goes well this time around! As for the agression, my 2005 mhh has recently started crouching and spreading his wings at me. He wants to eat me and i fear for my eyes as i use them quite allot. I would like to keep them. I,d like to keep the bird aswell. Any advice as I think I,VE DROPPED A CLANGER SOMEWHERE! If it was a Goldie reacting to me like this my wellies would be full of fear flood. Any help appreciated. Good luck!

[JoHo]

Well done Neil, Looking good.

Ps. Can someone get the previous post into the newbie section and off Neil's (well no Spike's ) thread, then it can be dealt with without ruining a cracking diary.

[PaulWar3]

Glad to see things are starting to go right for you Neil.:supz:
Love the pics. Is he still aggresive towards you? and will this reduce now you have him out flying, or will he still have to TLB?

Paul

[TLDWB]

Nice.:wink:

Tom

[Berkut]

Glad to see things are starting to go right for you Neil.:supz:
Love the pics. Is he still aggresive towards you? and will this reduce now you have him out flying, or will he still have to TLB?

Paul

Still showing aggression Paul.I am trying to work through it, but I can see him having a holiday.

[PaulWar3]

Still showing aggression Paul.I am trying to work through it, but I can see him having a holiday.

Keep up the good work, and keep the photos coming Neil:supz:

Paul

[Laggan]

Neil,

the dark night cometh to the end.

[Berkut]

10 weeks difference. Amazing. Tonight was real "hairs up on the back of the neck" stuff.

[Alan G]

Looking fabulous Neil. Shame you have encountered the sibling rivalry though, as it has been amazing watching the two of you progressing together.

Only wish i had the opportunity to have met you that day at work & met spike when he was still that more than little beautiful fluff ball. But from those recent photo's, he's turned into a right looking beautiful eagle.

Again, sorry to hear that he may have to go for a wee holiday, but if anyone knows what is required, well, I'm more than sure you know.

ATB

[Berkut]

Looking fabulous Neil. Shame you have encountered the sibling rivalry though, as it has been amazing watching the two of you progressing together.

Only wish i had the opportunity to have met you that day at work & met spike when he was still that more than little beautiful fluff ball. But from those recent photo's, he's turned into a right looking beautiful eagle.

Again, sorry to hear that he may have to go for a wee holiday, but if anyone knows what is required, well, I'm more than sure you know.

ATB

Thanks Alan, from the word go I have never seen any advantage of an imprint golden over a parent reared from a hunting point of view but I just love the process of imprinting an eagle and seeing them progress from downie through to feathering ,with the halfway stage being my favourite. Unfortunately it is all over too quickly and my plans were scuppered with the leg injury ,which couldn't have happened at a worse time. I seem to be turning the corner now though. If I imprint an eagle in future ,it will be for someone else, as I think that way of doing it has its advantages. The way Elsa turned out after changing owners last year is testament to that. Nevertheless it has been a privelage to be a part of it and to see Spike find his wings tonight gave me great satisfaction.
All the best,
Neil.

[GriffMJ]

Fantastic Neil...... well done :supz:

[Agent D.]

rep added!:P

[Berkutchi]

Great shots, Neil!

Sounds like a very enjoyable day.

Ah - the fun begins!

--Lauren

[Cyclone]

:supz::supz::supz::supz:...all i can say...quality mate!
Shane

[Elly]

Simply awesome. So glad hes back on track, he looks like hes enjoying himself finally being on the wing! :supz:

[GspJaz]

well done mr berkut youve done a great job:supz: i no you will argereay:yawinkle:
jaz

[RedNoseK9]

neil what a great progression in the diary mate hope he brings you lots more enjoyment this season

Wez

[Matthew Patching]

Very nice neil, I am once again green with envy!!!!!!!!!!.

I think that I will have to book a day with you, and I will carry the game bag, but only if I can bring my own!!!!

How are bently and cinnibar and co, doing?

ATB

Matt.

[Sophie]

10 weeks difference. Amazing. Tonight was real "hairs up on the back of the neck" stuff.

very nice pic :supz:

[Paddy1]

:supz: a job well done neil nice one mate

[Pendleside]

any more thoughts on the book neil ?
from the hits that your diaries get it would be a cert .
limited print run and signed copies would make it worth your while .:wink:
what about a dvd of a season with the eagles ?
then everyone could see "first hand" so to speak what its really like .
lauren and yourself write a very descriptive account of your days out but to watch it would be something else .
i'me sure everyone on here would agree .

[Matthew Patching]

any more thoughts on the book neil ?
from the hits that your diaries get it would be a cert .
limited print run and signed copies would make it worth your while .:wink:
what about a dvd of a season with the eagles ?
then everyone could see "first hand" so to speak what its really like .
lauren and yourself write a very descriptive account of your days out but to watch it would be something else .
i'me sure everyone on here would agree .

:supz: :supz: :supz:

[Berkut]

any more thoughts on the book neil ?
from the hits that your diaries get it would be a cert .
limited print run and signed copies would make it worth your while .:wink:
what about a dvd of a season with the eagles ?
then everyone could see "first hand" so to speak what its really like .
lauren and yourself write a very descriptive account of your days out but to watch it would be something else .
i'me sure everyone on here would agree .

Pete,
Thanks for the positive feedback. Hoping to do a video this season along with another successfull eagle flier.As for the book , mulling a few ideas around with a well known author, but hope to get another couple of seasons under my belt first.
Regards,
Neil.

[AngelJakki]

Great to see that he is getting up and going.

[TimDog80]

10 weeks difference. Amazing. Tonight was real "hairs up on the back of the neck" stuff.
or more like "filling your pants time";) :lol:
best of luck to you neil you deserve it after the frustrating moult you have had mate!!!

roll on another succesfull season:supz:

best regards
tim:D

p.s put my name down now for one of the first copys of the eagle video mate!!

[Austringer84]

im sooo pleased for you mate. well done for getting to this stage and the start of another hunting birds careers. keep us updates. Si

[FredrickFogg]

Pete,
Thanks for the positive feedback. Hoping to do a video this season along with another successfull eagle flier.As for the book , mulling a few ideas around with a well known author, but hope to get another couple of seasons under my belt first.
Regards,
Neil.

Neil,

Suggestion for a video some day in the future! You and a fellow eagle falconer both imprint a male and female goldie. Of course, you are video taping both of the imprinting processes. At the point you feel appropriate, you switch the birds and continue video taping both birds through the the first year of hunting. At the end of the tape, you both give an account of how you felt the whole thing went. I can guarantee you, I would buy it!

Really enjoying reading about everything you do with your eagles! :supz:

Fred

[Pendleside]

Pete,
Thanks for the positive feedback. Hoping to do a video this season along with another successfull eagle flier.As for the book , mulling a few ideas around with a well known author, but hope to get another couple of seasons under my belt first.
Regards,
Neil.

would the author be mr. m. tomkies ?:D

[Berkut]

Neil,

Suggestion for a video some day in the future! You and a fellow eagle falconer both imprint a male and female goldie. Of course, you are video taping both of the imprinting processes. At the point you feel appropriate, you switch the birds and continue video taping both birds through the the first year of hunting. At the end of the tape, you both give an account of how you felt the whole thing went. I can guarantee you, I would buy it!

Really enjoying reading about everything you do with your eagles! :supz:

Fred

Thanks Fred.Sounds like a good plan.

[Berkut]

would the author be mr. m. tomkies ?:D

Never heard of him Pete. 8-) ;)

[HawkEagle]

Neil, if you do it I'll be up for one.

[Pendleside]

Neil, if you do it I'll be up for one.

me too .
i want mine signed by the fella you've never heard of as well . :supz:

you should sell your sofa on ebay .
complete with the massive stain that looks like a well known author you've never heard of holding a baby golden .

very wierd .
on a par with the "virgin mary" cheese on toast auction .
99p start .....no reserve . :D

[JoHo]

Hi Neil,
Any updates, what has Spike been up to?

Johann

[Berkut]

Hi Neil,
Any updates, what has Spike been up to?

Johann

Johann,
Lauren was across for a while today and we had him out for 4 hours.She is going to post some photos shortly.
Neil.

[JoHo]

Looking forward to it.

[Berkutchi]

Went out with Neil today to give Spike a chance to stretch his wings. The weather was absolutely lovely - being stuck in Oxfordshire the past three weeks, I was delighted at the sunlight and gentle breeze.

In flight, Spike is wobbly, clumsy, and unsure. Most landings are tantamount to crash landings. However, even today, one could see him progress in flight duration and confidence. He wasn't very aerial, but did play about the countryside - and seemed to enjoy himself. He let the wind carry him and had a few long jaunts across the area and back.

Buzzards called indignantly overhead, kestrels flitted about, and a tiercel even powered across the sky. Nice day to share with a young golden. After sitting for a while on a rocky outcropping, Spike lay down and fell fast asleep! In the sunshine, it was hard to blame him. I nearly did the same. In the final photo, you can spot Neil on the hillside following suit.

--Lauren

[RedNoseK9]

Stunning pics again lauren and a great day with yet another great eagle neil

Wez

[SakerYZF]

Great pics Lauren , he's looking great :-)

[WildKestrel]

Really nice photos.. i'm enjoying this thread.. keep it coming, hehe :supz:

[B C]

Looks like a nice way to spend an afternoon Lauren.

ATB
Bernie

[Lady]

Fantastic pictures - love the last one.

[Berkut]

Weather wasn't looking good today.Wet with no wind to speak off ,but Lauren and I took Spike out for a couple of hours. He did take a couple of really decent flights today,each time landing back where he started,but sods law being what it is,it was raining heavily so the cameras were tucked away.

A couple of photos anyway.

[JoHo]

Wow, he looks really good in the picture with Lauren.

[TimDog80]

looking real good neil:supz: ,
any idea how far away he is from being shown quarry??

best regards
tim:D

[Ned]

great photos lauren,i seen spike about six weeks ago what a difference,:supz: atb ned.

[RedNoseK9]

Once again some great pics nice neil and lauren cant wait to get out with you mate

Wez

[Austringer84]

really nice fotos mate as always. glad to see you guys making progress.

si

[Matthew Patching]

He's looking good Neil,

Any news on his agresion issues, have they abbated since hacking began, as I guesse he is atleast using some of the energy that would be channelled into aggression.

Whats your training plan for him.

I hope that you are well, and that cinnibar is getting back to her old self.

All the best

Matt.

[Palmer]

looks apsolutly amazing Neil, you've done a great job!:supz:

Ed

[PaulWar3]

Wow, he looks really good in the picture with Lauren.

Totally agree, he looks stunning.:supz:

Paul

[Gary F]

Went out with Neil today to give Spike a chance to stretch his wings. The weather was absolutely lovely - being stuck in Oxfordshire the past three weeks, I was delighted at the sunlight and gentle breeze.

In flight, Spike is wobbly, clumsy, and unsure. Most landings are tantamount to crash landings. However, even today, one could see him progress in flight duration and confidence. He wasn't very aerial, but did play about the countryside - and seemed to enjoy himself. He let the wind carry him and had a few long jaunts across the area and back.

Buzzards called indignantly overhead, kestrels flitted about, and a tiercel even powered across the sky. Nice day to share with a young golden. After sitting for a while on a rocky outcropping, Spike lay down and fell fast asleep! In the sunshine, it was hard to blame him. I nearly did the same. In the final photo, you can spot Neil on the hillside following suit.

--Lauren
great pics as always lauren ,hes looking good, update on cinnibar neil???

[JuliaK]

great pics again.He's very dark..:) it's a great eagle.
very good pics espc the one with lauren :)

[ReluctantTwitcher]

Buzzards called indignantly overhead, kestrels flitted about, and a tiercel even powered across the sky. Nice day to share with a young golden. After sitting for a while on a rocky outcropping, Spike lay down and fell fast asleep! In the sunshine, it was hard to blame him.
--Lauren

My favourite quote! (Now that would be a great opening passage for an eagle book!)
Once again, love the great pics & texts. All the best to you both. Cheers,

/Magnus

[Kevin Massey]

Great stuff Neil....Hope the thread excellerates again soon :supz:

[TimDog80]

Great stuff Neil....Hope the thread excellerates again soon :supz:
have to agree as neils thread on his eagle make the forum what it is to me:!: :D ...........its nice to come in and switch on your cpu to see how a fellow falconers bird is coming along especially when its of the calibre of neils eagles!!!!!!:D

regards
tim

[PitBullOne]

nice pics lauren,bad hat.
good looking boy,i mean the eagle niel,isnt he dark,will he remain that way ,very nice,

[Elly]

Hows the lad getting on at hack Neil? Anymore aggression or has he calmed down a bit? How long til his first proper hunting trip? :twisted:

[Berkut]

Hows the lad getting on at hack Neil? Anymore aggression or has he calmed down a bit? How long til his first proper hunting trip? :twisted:

Elly,
He's coming on. Getting out most days for 2 or 3 hours at a time.Aggression continues but I think I am managing it reasonably well.Should be out for his first real days hunting next week.I am just back in and here are some photos of him tonight.
Neil.

[Berkut]

He hoods a treat.

[GriffMJ]

He hoods a treat.


That hood used to look like this... :lol: :lol: :supz: He looks great Neil..... wish I could see him soaring in the flesh.

http://www.m-jhoods.co.uk/M-J%20Hoods3/images/Eagle/Dutch2/RDE1.JPG

[TimDog80]

looks likes hes progressing nicely mate:D :D

best regards
tim:D

[Berkut]

looks likes hes progressing nicely mate:D :D

best regards
tim:D

Thanks Tim.He's coming on a treat.I am concentrating on travelling, hooding and carrying on the fist at the moment and he is great on all counts.Weight creeping down for his hunting trip next week.He still has no idea I supply the food but is happy to come looking for me if he loses sight of me,even with a full crop.

[Matthew Patching]

Thanks Tim.He's coming on a treat.I am concentrating on travelling, hooding and carrying on the fist at the moment and he is great on all counts.Weight creeping down for his hunting trip next week.He still has no idea I supply the food but is happy to come looking for me if he loses sight of me,even with a full crop.

That sounds like it should be neil, I wish you luck in your first hunting trips, and hopfully he'll have one first time out.

[TiercelJim]

Thanks Tim.He's coming on a treat.I am concentrating on travelling, hooding and carrying on the fist at the moment and he is great on all counts.Weight creeping down for his hunting trip next week.He still has no idea I supply the food but is happy to come looking for me if he loses sight of me,even with a full crop.

that must be a great feeling niel!he looks stunning by the way,
atb,jim

[TimDog80]

Thanks Tim.He's coming on a treat.I am concentrating on travelling, hooding and carrying on the fist at the moment and he is great on all counts.Weight creeping down for his hunting trip next week.He still has no idea I supply the food but is happy to come looking for me if he loses sight of me,even with a full crop.
top stuff mate!!!
well ill be looking forward to your post on his first hunting trip!!!:D :supz: , i take it hes started dummy work then has he?? or is that gonna be happening this week??

best regards
tim:D

[RedNoseK9]

Neil he is doing great now mate cant wait to get geisha out but she dropped a deck the other day so a bit of a wait to go yet

Wez

[Berkut]

top stuff mate!!!
well ill be looking forward to your post on his first hunting trip!!!:D :supz: , i take it hes started dummy work then has he?? or is that gonna be happening this week??

best regards
tim:D

Tim,
I have done a bit of work on rabbit and hare carcasses,but it's the real thing from now on hopefully.

[Elly]

Top man. :supz: Sure he'll take to hare like a duck to water.

[TimDog80]

Tim,
I have done a bit of work on rabbit and hare carcasses,but it's the real thing from now on hopefully.
silly of me to ask really i guessed you were already onto it:wink: :lol: :oops:
are you going to try and enter him off the fist or when hes up in the air then?? (may sound a silly question?)

best regards
tim:D

[Berkut]

silly of me to ask really i guessed you were already onto it:wink: :lol: :oops:
are you going to try and enter him off the fist or when hes up in the air then?? (may sound a silly question?)

best regards
tim:D

Tim,
I only really use the carcass to get him interested initially and to have it estabished as a recall tool if required. I prefer any wrestling to be done with kills. I will fly him at quarry off the fist initially as his flying skills are limited.I am waiting for the right wind to get him waiting on.All looking good at the moment though in comparison to Elsa at this stage last year.
Neil.

[TimDog80]

Tim,
I only really use the carcass to get him interested initially and to have it estabished as a recall tool if required. I prefer any wrestling to be done with kills. I will fly him at quarry off the fist initially as his flying skills are limited.I am waiting for the right wind to get him waiting on.All looking good at the moment though in comparison to Elsa at this stage last year.
Neil.
good stuff mate i bet your raring to go now, be nice to see all the efforts you have put into him pay off for you in the field!!!:D
look forward to the posts:supz:

best regards
tim:D

[Sarah J]

Spike is such a stud, those hares will be quaking in their forms :heart:

[PitBullOne]

niel if you listen carefully you can here it coming,

[Ares]

hey berkut any news on spike, agresion, wheight, etc and how is cinibar and the other eagles moult ?

[Berkut]

hey berkut any news on spike, agresion, wheight, etc and how is cinibar and the other eagles moult ?


Spike is doing very well. I think I have managed to reduce his aggression by giving him time at tame hack.He topped out at 8lbs 4 oz and is currently 7lbs 10oz and seems keen to hunt so I will be out hunting with him very soon.He is hooding and travelling well so things are looking good.

Cinnibar is moulting well ,but her wing injuries have not improved any. I will never get to the bottom of how they were caused ,although I have been told one or two stories that explain a lot but there is no point in posting them on here as they will be deleted in quick time.

Bentley is also moulting well and looking good.

Vlad was in a disgraceful condition when I took possession of him ,but he has moulted 6 of the 7 broken tail feathers and all bar 2 of the broken primary feathers.

I will give an update and post some photographs later in the week.
Neil.

[Lady]

It's great to hear that he's coming along so well. Lovely photos - he looks like a very confident chap!

[Elly]

Spike is doing very well. I think I have managed to reduce his aggression by giving him time at tame hack.He topped out at 8lbs 4 oz and is currently 7lbs 10oz and seems keen to hunt so I will be out hunting with him very soon.He is hooding and travelling well so things are looking good.

Cinnibar is moulting well ,but her wing injuries have not improved any. I will never get to the bottom of how they were caused ,although I have been told one or two stories that explain a lot but there is no point in posting them on here as they will be deleted in quick time.

Bentley is also moulting well and looking good.

Vlad was in a disgraceful condition when I took possession of him ,but he has moulted 6 of the 7 broken tail feathers and all bar 2 of the broken primary feathers.

I will give an update and post some photographs later in the week.
Neil.


Good news pretty much all round then, with the exception of Cinnibars injuries not improving. I hate to ask, but whats the course of action for her, will she fly again or is this her retirement? :(
Looking forward to the photos.
ATB
Elly
x

[Berkut]

Good news pretty much all round then, with the exception of Cinnibars injuries not improving. I hate to ask, but whats the course of action for her, will she fly again or is this her retirement? :(
Looking forward to the photos.
ATB
Elly
x

Elly,
Apparently long term rest at the moment. The vet mentioned the possibility of an investigative operation on both wings but I am avoiding that like the plague. She looks really good ,but if she bates even a couple of times the wings droop badly for an hour or two. Sad really when she is only nine and has a lot of years ahead of her.
Neil.

[Gram]

Elly,
Apparently long term rest at the moment. The vet mentioned the possibility of an investigative operation on both wings but I am avoiding that like the plague. She looks really good ,but if she bates even a couple of times the wings droop badly for an hour or two. Sad really when she is only nine and has a lot of years ahead of her.
Neil.
Dont give up hope Neil im sure she will get better and have a long and productive life with you.I know how you must feel mate it must be agony.
graham

[Elly]

Elly,
Apparently long term rest at the moment. The vet mentioned the possibility of an investigative operation on both wings but I am avoiding that like the plague. She looks really good ,but if she bates even a couple of times the wings droop badly for an hour or two. Sad really when she is only nine and has a lot of years ahead of her.
Neil.

I can understand wanting to avoid the operation. Could potentially do a lot more harm than good, rather a lot of variables. Let her take it easy and see how things progress, i really hope she comes up good even if it takes a while to get there.

What are your expectations for Spike in his first season in terms of numbers? I know its a very open ended question with a lot of variables, but given how often you intend to be out with him, do you have a rough number in your head? Do you think it'll mostly be off the fist, or with the tame hack, do you invisage some waiting on as well?

Elly
x

[Berkut]

Dont give up hope Neil im sure she will get better and have a long and productive life with you.I know how you must feel mate it must be agony.
graham

Thanks Graham.

I can understand wanting to avoid the operation. Could potentially do a lot more harm than good, rather a lot of variables. Let her take it easy and see how things progress, i really hope she comes up good even if it takes a while to get there.

What are your expectations for Spike in his first season in terms of numbers? I know its a very open ended question with a lot of variables, but given how often you intend to be out with him, do you have a rough number in your head? Do you think it'll mostly be off the fist, or with the tame hack, do you invisage some waiting on as well?

Elly
x


Elly,
I have had a lot on but hope to have him out for real on Wednesday. I have been given the option of some good off the fist flying as soon as the crops are cut,but I feel it is important to have him waiting on first. Bentley's first 2 seasons were exclusively waiting on and the off the fist stuff came after that. I think doing it that way round is what made him what he is. I will let Spike chase off the fist till he gains some experience but as soon as I get the right wind conditions and have some weight control over him I will opting for the waiting on flights. I am not aiming high in numbers but that will really be dictated by how he performs. It may be that numbers is the key once he starts killing in the same way as an imprint gos. At the moment I am very pleased with how he is turning out.
Neil.

[TimDog80]

Thanks Graham.




Elly,
I have had a lot on but hope to have him out for real on Wednesday. I have been given the option of some good off the fist flying as soon as the crops are cut,but I feel it is important to have him waiting on first. Bentley's first 2 seasons were exclusively waiting on and the off the fist stuff came after that. I think doing it that way round is what made him what he is. I will let Spike chase off the fist till he gains some experience but as soon as I get the right wind conditions and have some weight control over him I will opting for the waiting on flights. I am not aiming high in numbers but that will really be dictated by how he performs. It may be that numbers is the key once he starts killing in the same way as an imprint gos. At the moment I am very pleased with how he is turning out.
Neil.
rock on wednesday mate:supz:
wish you a great successfull season once again neil and just hope cinnibar come round for you in the long run fella, my heart goes out to you with her you must be feeeling really gutted over her condition still:(

best regards as always
tim:D

[Ned]

hope it all goes well on wed.atb ned.

[Austringer84]

havent had a chance to catch up with this thread for a wee while, but so pleased to hear its going well, with the exception of cinnibar, good luck for wednesday.

si

[Elly]

Hope today goes well, can we have an update when you get back? :D

[GSP]

Hi Neil
How did it go with Spike today?
I hope you had better weather than we had down south.
Steve

[Berkut]

Hi Neil
How did it go with Spike today?
I hope you had better weather than we had down south.
Steve
Steve,
It was heavy rain where I intended to go today so I just took him locally for a couple of hours .He is starting to get a bit more aerial .I am taking him to the hunting ground tomorrow. Forgot the camera today but will make sure I take it tomorrow.
Neil

[Salty]

Elly,
He's coming on. Getting out most days for 2 or 3 hours at a time.Aggression continues but I think I am managing it reasonably well.Should be out for his first real days hunting next week.I am just back in and here are some photos of him tonight.
Neil.

awsome my friend ,hes grew quick mate :supz:

[Berkut]

awsome my friend ,hes grew quick mate :supz:

Thanks Salty,he certainly has.Hopefully make his first kill very soon.

[Commet07]

great pic and a lovey bird hope all goes well for u can u say hi to lauren for me and me mrs (Tina and Shawn) we met her at the festival thanks

[Berkut]

great pic and a lovey bird hope all goes well for u can u say hi to lauren for me and me mrs (Tina and Shawn) we met her at the festival thanks

Will do.

[Berkut]

I managed out with Spike today as planned. The wind was really strong, which ruled out much off the fist stuff,but as it was blowing up the hill face it was looking like "waiting on" was possible.
I took the hood off and Spike immediately pushed off the fist into the wind and spent the next 15 minutes or so thoroughly enjoying himself.He was waiting on at a couple of hundred feet and it was amazing how quickly he got the hang of it.
After the first stint he landed on the hillside and I managed to flush a couple of rabbits for him. He did attempt to chase them but they were a long way off and with the strong wind he ended up wheeling around the sky again.
I spent 3 hours just letting him do his own thing, as and when it pleased him, and it was really worthwhile as he managed a lot of flying.Although he has no food association with me he never wandered far. The breeder was there also and liked what he saw. Never got many pics but here are the ones I did manage.

[Rab Marshall]

nice,he'll be fit fast neil,rab

[Pendleside]

looking forward to this fella performing in the field .
cant be long now.8-)
way to go neil .

[Alf]

Neil it’s been and still is blowing hard down here today, wouldn’t even attempt to take my musket out he would be blown off the fist.
Do eagles cope better on the fist in strong winds with there bulk?
Must admit mate your eagle looks impressive in the air. Alf.

[Berkut]

Neil it’s been and still is blowing hard down here today, wouldn’t even attempt to take my musket out he would be blown off the fist.
Do eagles cope better on the fist in strong winds with there bulk?
Must admit mate your eagle looks impressive in the air. Alf.

Alf.The stronger the wind the better for waiting on.I've flown them in winds I could barely stand up in. Waiting on is the way to go. Totally about 10 weeks worth of invites this season to mountainous terrain.Can't wait.

[Gerry4292]

This htraed makes great reading please keep it coming,
Stunning bird Neil.

[AlexB]

Good to see things are hotting or so to speak up in Gods Country. Looking forward to seeing Spike at work later this year Neil.

Hope the first kill comes soon for him.

Finger crossed Cinnibar's recovery is full and complete.

ATB

Alex

[TimDog80]

looking good mate:D
credit to you!!!

regards
tim:D

[Berkut]

Neil it’s been and still is blowing hard down here today, wouldn’t even attempt to take my musket out he would be blown off the fist.
Do eagles cope better on the fist in strong winds with there bulk?
Must admit mate your eagle looks impressive in the air. Alf.

Alf,
Misread your post earlier.If you can get them to keep their wings tucked in while on the fist they are no problem.If they open their wings at all they can be a nightmare.
Neil.

[JedT]

Do eagles cope better on the fist in strong winds with there bulk?
Alf i dont think they do,what i find best is put your right arm around them and pull them in close when walking with them in strong winds,Jed.

[JedT]

you beat me to it Neil,Jed

[Laggan]

Hi Neil,

Thinking about your reply to Elly prompted several questions for me regarding flying style and developing all round abilities, especially given the tremendous success you have had with Bentley.

Do you feel that flying from waiting-on early in your eagle's exposure to hunting is essential for developing their self-confidence and control of their aerial prowess, as demonstrable with Bentley, before flying off the fist? I guess what I am trying to elucidate is your thoughts on why this way round has worked so well?

Reversing the scenario, if one was to initially fly off the fist, as may be more typical in lowland hawking, but subsequently wanted to take advantage of opportunity to do more waiting-on hill/mountain hawking, what sort of problems/issues would you envisage that might need to be addressed? Would the lowland hawker's eagle's field performance be noticeably inferior?

My third question concerns flying weight. Perhaps showing some ignorance here, but I would anticipate being able to fly from waiting-on in higher condition (and thus weight) compared with off-the-fist. Please correct me if I am wrong. Consequently I would be interested to know whether in Spike's first season if you flew exclusively from waiting-on, or exclusively from off-the-fist, whether this would require different weight management, not just from an entering perspective but from your approach to this formative season? If you are able to fly almost exclusively from waiting-on and then in future seasons chose to alter this to predominantly off-the-fist (not that you would necessarily), would this require flying him somewhat keener?

Apologies for the plethora of questions, but your post regarding contrasting flight styles really got me thinking.

Regards.

Iain



Elly,
I have had a lot on but hope to have him out for real on Wednesday. I have been given the option of some good off the fist flying as soon as the crops are cut,but I feel it is important to have him waiting on first. Bentley's first 2 seasons were exclusively waiting on and the off the fist stuff came after that. I think doing it that way round is what made him what he is. I will let Spike chase off the fist till he gains some experience but as soon as I get the right wind conditions and have some weight control over him I will opting for the waiting on flights. I am not aiming high in numbers but that will really be dictated by how he performs. It may be that numbers is the key once he starts killing in the same way as an imprint gos. At the moment I am very pleased with how he is turning out.
Neil.

[Berkut]

Hi Neil,

Thinking about your reply to Elly prompted several questions for me regarding flying style and developing all round abilities, especially given the tremendous success you have had with Bentley.

Do you feel that flying from waiting-on early in your eagle's exposure to hunting is essential for developing their self-confidence and control of their aerial prowess, as demonstrable with Bentley, before flying off the fist? I guess what I am trying to elucidate is your thoughts on why this way round has worked so well?

Reversing the scenario, if one was to initially fly off the fist, as may be more typical in lowland hawking, but subsequently wanted to take advantage of opportunity to do more waiting-on hill/mountain hawking, what sort of problems/issues would you envisage that might need to be addressed? Would the lowland hawker's eagle's field performance be noticeably inferior?

My third question concerns flying weight. Perhaps showing some ignorance here, but I would anticipate being able to fly from waiting-on in higher condition (and thus weight) compared with off-the-fist. Please correct me if I am wrong. Consequently I would be interested to know whether in Spike's first season if you flew exclusively from waiting-on, or exclusively from off-the-fist, whether this would require different weight management, not just from an entering perspective but from your approach to this formative season? If you are able to fly almost exclusively from waiting-on and then in future seasons chose to alter this to predominantly off-the-fist (not that you would necessarily), would this require flying him somewhat keener?

Apologies for the plethora of questions, but your post regarding contrasting flight styles really got me thinking.

Regards.

Iain

Iain,
Firstly, I do think it is important to practice the waiting on flying first. Although it doesn't take a great deal of fitness,it does require technique. As a general rule I think,given the right wind conditions,most goldens will wait on but if they haven't done much of it they can look clumsy when quarry is flushed underneath them. They other thing is they really seem to love flying in that style. If given the choice I would rather fly exclusively from the waiting on position for a lesser bag,although off the fist is great for improving fitness(and filling the freezer).

If a bird was to be flown off the fist exclusively in the early stages it may not perform as well waiting on (Purdey is an example of this ) but generally it doesn't necessarily follow. In certain wind conditions the eagles have no choice but to go up,its their capabilites once they get there that may be doubtfull.

Spot on with the 3rd point.Bentley flies off the fist at 6lb 15 ounces. In very strong winds I could fly him waiting on at nearly 8 pounds and his response is very good provided it is the right type of terrain. The big problem would be mixing and matching the 2 types of flying with the weights required and the adjustment of those weights,so I always have him at the lower end.

The big problem for off the fist, in even a moderate strength of wind, an experienced eagle will go and look for lift and tend to stay where the lift is, as it requires less effort. If you have a high density of hares in that situation it is a recipe for disaster.

When you are flying in good overall waiting on conditions it is best to have to work for your hares as it keeps the eagles directly above and focused on the job in hand .

Hope this answers most of the points Iain,but if it doesn't, no problem, fire away.
Regards,
Neil.

[Laggan]

Neil,

thanks for the detailed and informative reply, but if I may ask another question related to the extract below......

Given how much effort and time goes into getting your eagles fit, and the substantial weight reduction required, I can understand that mixing and matching the contrasting flight styles would in effect be impossible. Flying from waiting-on and then having to take large amounts of weight off for off-the-fist, then back up again - it just doesn't seem practicable - the hawking season is short enough as it is!

Based upon your experience with Bentley, how do you go about indentifying the right flying weight for the yet-to-be-entered Spike? Perhaps I should try and explain my struggle here......you intend to fly Spike predominantly from waiting on, so in determining his flying weight is the flight style the predominant determinant? Given the quite large range you quoted for Bentley, even though you fly him towards the lower end of the range, as yet presumably you will not have established Spike's range. I am not sure I have explained this very well, but hope that you can decipher the intent. Also, I believe Bentley was parent-reared and Spike is an imprint, so what influence do you anticipate this will have on their operating weight range?

Apologies again for more questions Neil, but being able to explore this with you is fascinating stuff. Thanks.

Iain

Iain,
...............
Spot on with the 3rd point.Bentley flies off the fist at 6lb 15 ounces. In very strong winds I could fly him waiting on at nearly 8 pounds and his response is very good provided it is the right type of terrain. The big problem would be mixing and matching the 2 types of flying with the weights required and the adjustment of those weights,so I always have him at the lower end.

Hope this answers most of the points Iain,but if it doesn't, no problem, fire away.
Regards,
Neil.

[Berkut]

Neil,

thanks for the detailed and informative reply, but if I may ask another question related to the extract below......

Given how much effort and time goes into getting your eagles fit, and the substantial weight reduction required, I can understand that mixing and matching the contrasting flight styles would in effect be impossible. Flying from waiting-on and then having to take large amounts of weight off for off-the-fist, then back up again - it just doesn't seem practicable - the hawking season is short enough as it is!

Based upon your experience with Bentley, how do you go about indentifying the right flying weight for the yet-to-be-entered Spike? Perhaps I should try and explain my struggle here......you intend to fly Spike predominantly from waiting on, so in determining his flying weight is the flight style the predominant determinant? Given the quite large range you quoted for Bentley, even though you fly him towards the lower end of the range, as yet presumably you will not have established Spike's range. I am not sure I have explained this very well, but hope that you can decipher the intent. Also, I believe Bentley was parent-reared and Spike is an imprint, so what influence do you anticipate this will have on their operating weight range?

Apologies again for more questions Neil, but being able to explore this with you is fascinating stuff. Thanks.

Iain

Iain,
As it stands with Spike being an imprint it may blow most of the theory out the water. I stated previously that I don't see any great advantage in flying an imprint eagle over a parent reared and I stand by that, apart from they MAY have less of an inclination to go and self hunt because they want to be near you.That may not be the case.

At the moment I am between a rock and a hard place as the eagles slim down as they approach hard penning and then pile on the weight over the next few weeks, reaching the highest weight they will probably ever be. I have rationed Spikes food to keep his weight down but feel he should be allowed to "top out" so I may have to let him fill his boots for a few weeks.

Either way, I will let him fly, regardless of his weight ,and will have to edge the weight down very slowly to gain some level of control whether he be flying from the waiting on or off the fist until I find his best hunting weight.

Neil.

[Laggan]

At the moment I am between a rock and a hard place as the eagles slim down as they approach hard penning and then pile on the weight over the next few weeks, reaching the highest weight they will probably ever be. I have rationed Spikes food to keep his weight down but feel he should be allowed to "top out" so I may have to let him fill his boots for a few weeks.


Neil,

I thought about PMing you because I don't want to divert the thread, but reflecting upon it I felt others may be interested in the question/answer as so few have the experience you have.

I have never allowed my birds to put on unlimited weight during the moult, I always control it - they are allowed to eat good quality food permitting a successful moult, but I limit their total weight gain because it has to eventually come off again when taken up. Irrespective of falcons or hawks, I then follow the principle of reducing rations with introduction of increasing exercise, giving the nett effect of weight loss until the bird reaches flying (hunting)weight. As the season progresses, the bird is exercised and hunted harder, consequently there is a 'small' percentage weight increase as the muscle density builds up over the season. Daily weight is adjusted according to the usual other factors encountered through the season.

However, the weight profile of moult weight being the highest, followed by reduction to hunting weight, then 'small' increase as the season progresses does not seem to fit the profile you describe for your eagles. Apologies if I have misunderstood the above extract, but it appears your eagles reduce weight to hard penning, then go through substantial weight increase before "topping out". Is this purely a response to your hard fitness work and building large amounts of muscle mass, ie ounces-worth of muscle? When "topped out" do you then adjust downwards to maintain the control you seek?

Too much time on my hands, as you know, but I would rather ask questions than remain ignorant. Thanks.

Iain

[Berkut]

Iain,
This topping out is only in the first year.For example Bentley came out the pen at 6 months old and weighed 9lbs 12 oz.After that I moulted him around 8lbs - 8.5 lbs. Last year he was moulted in seclusion and came out the pen at 9lb 4 oz.This was an error on my part and it put his hunting season 6 - 8 weeks behind schedule. This year he has moulted well on the block at around 8lbs 4 oz. I am already cutting his rations to have him ready for early October. He will be responsive from around 7lb 12 oz and that is when I commence my fitness regime.By the time he is on the hill for the first day at the hares he will already be very fit. Spike will be pushed up in weight as from now and then brought down slowly but will still be allowed to fly and gain muscle.
Neil.

[M Donnelly]

Neil,

I thought about PMing you because I don't want to divert the thread, but reflecting upon it I felt others may be interested in the question/answer as so few have the experience you have.

I have never allowed my birds to put on unlimited weight during the moult, I always control it - they are allowed to eat good quality food permitting a successful moult, but I limit their total weight gain because it has to eventually come off again when taken up. Irrespective of falcons or hawks, I then follow the principle of reducing rations with introduction of increasing exercise, giving the nett effect of weight loss until the bird reaches flying (hunting)weight. As the season progresses, the bird is exercised and hunted harder, consequently there is a 'small' percentage weight increase as the muscle density builds up over the season. Daily weight is adjusted according to the usual other factors encountered through the season.

However, the weight profile of moult weight being the highest, followed by reduction to hunting weight, then 'small' increase as the season progresses does not seem to fit the profile you describe for your eagles. Apologies if I have misunderstood the above extract, but it appears your eagles reduce weight to hard penning, then go through substantial weight increase before "topping out". Is this purely a response to your hard fitness work and building large amounts of muscle mass, ie ounces-worth of muscle? When "topped out" do you then adjust downwards to maintain the control you seek?

Too much time on my hands, as you know, but I would rather ask questions than remain ignorant. Thanks.

Iain

Iain,
I don't know about others but I am enjoying this thread and think your questions are good ones that a lot of people can learn from. To me that is one of the things the forum is for. For people to gain knowledge of others sucesses, experiance and failings.

Martin

[Laggan]

Thanks Neil,

that clarified things for me......and I appreciate your time and patience in addressing my questions.

All the best.

Iain

[Berkut]

Thanks Neil,

that clarified things for me......and I appreciate your time and patience in addressing my questions.

All the best.

Iain

No problem Iain.Anytime.
Neil.

[Greg]

Hi Neil,
I just managed to get back on the forum, I'm over in California at the moment but looking foreward to seeing the Spike in the flesh when I get back.
Greg

[Berkut]

Just a quick update on Spike.Up until today he has been progressing nicely with little aggression.Out the blue this afternoon he took a very bad temper tantrum,refusing the hood,lashing out with his feet and refusing to stand on the fist to the point I was very concerned about his well being.Eventually I managed to get him on the block and fortunately had to go out for a few hours.
When I came back a short time ago he was back to his old self,as if nothing had happened. I think he needs a holiday.

[FredrickFogg]

Just a quick update on Spike.Up until today he has been progressing nicely with little aggression.Out the blue this afternoon he took a very bad temper tantrum,refusing the hood,lashing out with his feet and refusing to stand on the fist to the point I was very concerned about his well being.Eventually I managed to get him on the block and fortunately had to go out for a few hours.
When I came back a short time ago he was back to his old self,as if nothing had happened. I think he needs a holiday.

Neil,

I don't know anything about eagles, but sounds like he needs what most birds need, to get out there and kill something. LOL Looking forward to the hunting stories with him.

Fred

[Goldie]

Just a quick update on Spike.Up until today he has been progressing nicely with little aggression.Out the blue this afternoon he took a very bad temper tantrum,refusing the hood,lashing out with his feet and refusing to stand on the fist to the point I was very concerned about his well being.Eventually I managed to get him on the block and fortunately had to go out for a few hours.
When I came back a short time ago he was back to his old self,as if nothing had happened. I think he needs a holiday.

It was also very warm Neil, mine was a bit feisty as well but calmed down after a good spray.

[Alf]

Neil he is sulking because you have new gos!. You know he want all the attention. :yawinkle: Alf.


Just a quick update on Spike.Up until today he has been progressing nicely with little aggression.Out the blue this afternoon he took a very bad temper tantrum,refusing the hood,lashing out with his feet and refusing to stand on the fist to the point I was very concerned about his well being.Eventually I managed to get him on the block and fortunately had to go out for a few hours.
When I came back a short time ago he was back to his old self,as if nothing had happened. I think he needs a holiday.

[Richard]

Any updates Neil, we're waiting with baited breath my friend :supz: :lol:

[Gary F]

Any updates Neil, we're waiting with baited breath my friend :supz: :lol:
yes hows hes doing?????
hows cinnibar doing now, pm or email me mate if you dont want to talk about cinn on here
gary,,

[Berkut]

Any updates Neil, we're waiting with baited breath my friend :supz: :lol:

yes hows hes doing?????
hows cinnibar doing now, pm or email me mate if you dont want to talk about cinn on here
gary,,

Richard,Gary,
Spike is doing well.I am trying to push his weight up as high as possible at the moment before bringing it down as hunting season approaches. Cinnibar is much the same as before.Apologise for not updating the thread much these days. My enthusiasm to do this is much reduced at the moment.When you raise a decent sum of money for the festival tent and travel down and get verbally abused by an idiot in admin who has filled himself with Stella and thinks it's ok to do so,you maybe see where I am coming from.
All the best,
Neil.

[Salty]

Richard,Gary,
Spike is doing well.I am trying to push his weight up as high as possible at the moment before bringing it down as hunting season approaches. Cinnibar is much the same as before.Apologise for not updating the thread much these days. My enthusiasm to do this is much reduced at the moment.When you raise a decent sum of money for the festival tent and travel down and get verbally abused by an idiot in admin who has filled himself with Stella and thinks it's ok to do so,you maybe see where I am coming from.
All the best,
Neil.
thought summat was up mate been missing your crack on here ,id be the same also after your contributions mate ,wish id went there myself now and ad a pint or two with you mate ,:supz: :supz:

[Richard]

Keep the falconry alive Neil, i'll be accused of jumping on a band wagon but your threads are one of the few reasons I post on the FALCONRY forum :yawinkle:

[Gary F]

Keep the falconry alive Neil, i'll be accused of jumping on a band wagon but your threads are one of the few reasons I post on the FALCONRY forum :yawinkle:
well said mate, rep point wouldve been added,and you salty
gary

[KiteTrainer]

Look forward to a great Eagle season, everything is shaping up nicely:supz:

[Sarah J]

Keep those pics & diary up-dates coming Officer Hunter - they are fab :yawinkle: :)

[TimDog80]

Look forward to a great Eagle season, everything is shaping up nicely:supz:
glad to hear it john:supz:
good luck to you and neil im sure you will both have another great season:D

p.s shame lauren aint gonnna be there to open the gates and carry the game bag for you guys all season......again:lol: (and her great write ups ofcourse)


best regards
tim

[Sprout]

Looking forward to seeing some decent hawking this season - think got a good deal there - you keep Sarah, I get to see quality eagle hawking!!!

[Berkut]

glad to hear it john
good luck to you and neil im sure you will both have another great season:D

p.s shame lauren aint gonnna be there to open the gates and carry the game bag for you guys all season......again:lol: (and her great write ups ofcourse)


best regards
tim

Cheers Tim,she's coming over in December so we'll see if we can make room for her in the team.She's really fond of my GWP Bisto so she may get to travel in the back of the jeep with her.:D ;)

[TimDog80]

Cheers Tim,she's coming over in December so we'll see if we can make room for her in the team.She's really fond of my GWP Bisto so she may get to travel in the back of the jeep with her.:D ;)
im sure she wont grumble with that;) , she must know her place in the pecking order by now:lol:

[Berkut]

im sure she wont grumble with that;) , she must know her place in the pecking order by now:lol:

You would think so Tim,but she can get ahead of herself now and again.:lol:

[KiteTrainer]

im sure she wont grumble with that;) , she must know her place in the pecking order by now:lol:

We might even get her to do some domestic chores like make the Tea:rolleyes:

[Berkut]

We might even get her to do some domestic chores like make the Tea:rolleyes:

You'll be lucky John.Not one of her strong points.;)

[KiteTrainer]

You'll be lucky John.Not one of her strong points.;)

Its just as well she can:rolleyes: write

[KiteTrainer]

im sure she wont grumble with that;) , she must know her place in the pecking order by now:lol:

The ars* end

[Berkutchi]

Hehe - yeah, gotta keep an eye on us okies!

Back with Bisto, aye - that'll be shining bright. You're stuck with me now. Just wait till this yank gives you scots a run for your money. :lol:

...but how the Hunters' will manage the rather complex gate system solo on the moors one can only imagine. :butthead:

--and as far as tea is concerned, let's not get hasty now. However, Jeff and Tcatanach will tell you I made a palatable pot recently. (isn't that right? ;) )

Cheers Tim! :-D

[Salty]

Hehe - yeah, gotta keep an eye on us okies!

Back with Bisto, aye - that'll be shining bright. You're stuck with me now. Just wait till this yank gives you scots a run for your money. :lol:

...but how the Hunters' will manage the rather complex gate system solo on the moors one can only imagine.

--and as far as tea is concerned, let's not get hasty now. However, Jeff and Tcatanach will tell you I made a palatable pot recently. (isn't that right?

Cheers Tim! HI LAUREN :heart: :heart: ;) XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXMMMMMWWWWWWAA AAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW

[KiteTrainer]

[QUOTE=Berkutchi;655247]Hehe - yeah, gotta keep an eye on us okies!

Back with Bisto, aye - that'll be shining bright. You're stuck with me now. Just wait till this yank gives you scots a run for your money. :lol:

...but how the Hunters' will manage the rather complex gate system solo on the moors one can only imagine. :butthead:

--and as far as tea is concerned, let's not get hasty now. However, Jeff and Tcatanach will tell you I made a palatable pot recently. (isn't that right? ;) )

Cheers Tim!

Did you use it to wash down a pie roll:lol:

[Tacatanach]

--and as far as tea is concerned, let's not get hasty now. However, Jeff and Tcatanach will tell you I made a palatable pot recently. (isn't that right? ;) )

Cheers Tim! :-D

Yes, the tea was amazing. I'll be keeping an eye out for the check in the mail for making that statement:lol:

[GyrXPeales]

Yes, the tea was amazing. I'll be keeping an eye out for the check in the mail for making that statement:lol:

Tea? Tea? Aw yes the Tea, brown liquid, pours like honey. Wait a minute Therese she told us that was a fecal float.
Er um, why yes the Tea was outstanding, Earl Grey, 1 lump, incredible.:lol:
:heart:
Jeff

[Tacatanach]

Tea? Tea? Aw yes the Tea, brown liquid, pours like honey. Wait a minute Therese she told us that was a fecal float.

Jeff

Thats right, i had thought those clumps were tea leaves she'd let in and drank it to be polite before she realized her mistake. :evil:

[Berkut]

Spike is doing well, and in many ways is the dream eagle,but unfortunately his random fits of aggression and temper continue,much the same as Elsa last year. I think he ultimately needs to be elsewhere with a stranger for a few weeks and to have his weight pushed up to the max in the process.

I didn't want to go down that road but I might be left with no choice.

I'll see how things progress and if the right person can be found.

Neil.

[Salty]

Spike is doing well, and in many ways is the dream eagle,but unfortunately his random fits of aggression and temper continue,much the same as Elsa last year. I think he ultimately needs to be elsewhere with a stranger for a few weeks and to have his weight pushed up to the max in the process.

I didn't want to go down that road but I might be left with no choice.

I'll see how things progress and if the right person can be found.

Neil.if anyone knows mate ,you do thats for sure ,good luck mate hes awesome :supz: ;)

[Laggan]

Spike is doing well, and in many ways is the dream eagle,but unfortunately his random fits of aggression and temper continue,much the same as Elsa last year. I think he ultimately needs to be elsewhere with a stranger for a few weeks and to have his weight pushed up to the max in the process.
Neil.

Neil,

having learned from your experiences with Elsa and incorporated this into your imprinting of Spike, do you now believe that such behaviour is an inevitable consequence of imprinting eagles? If you were to repeat the process in the future, is there anything you might do or attempt differently?

I understand that your ultimate falconry ambition is to fly the progeny of your own eagle breeding programme. Knowing all that you know now about imprinting eagles, are you a convert to the product of the process or would you fly the offspring as a parent-reared bird? I know you have a wonderful time in the imprinting stages, but I guess what I am asking is having for many years not seen particular benefits of imprint versus parent-reared eagle, if you could only ever fly on more eagle, which raising process would you choose and why?

Kind regards.

Iain

[PaulWar3]

Hows Spike getting on Neil. Any closer to been entered?

Ps Is your camera broke, there's been no pics for a while and we're all getting withdrawal symtoms. LOL.

Paul

[Berkut]

Neil,

having learned from your experiences with Elsa and incorporated this into your imprinting of Spike, do you now believe that such behaviour is an inevitable consequence of imprinting eagles? If you were to repeat the process in the future, is there anything you might do or attempt differently?

I understand that your ultimate falconry ambition is to fly the progeny of your own eagle breeding programme. Knowing all that you know now about imprinting eagles, are you a convert to the product of the process or would you fly the offspring as a parent-reared bird? I know you have a wonderful time in the imprinting stages, but I guess what I am asking is having for many years not seen particular benefits of imprint versus parent-reared eagle, if you could only ever fly on more eagle, which raising process would you choose and why?

Kind regards.

Iain


Iain,
Spikes behaviour is identical to Elsa's last year. For me it will be parent reared every time, unless I was imprinting an eagle for someone else and in truth I have only imprinted eagles because I love the progression from helpless downie through half downie/half feather to the real deal.Sharing that part of an eagles life is well worth doing. If I am ever lucky enough to breed from Cinnibar and Bentley my hope would be to let them rear a male eaglet and I would fly that eaglet for the rest of my days and may imprint a female and let a friend fly it.
ATB,
Neil.

[Laggan]

Iain,
Spikes behaviour is identical to Elsa's last year. For me it will be parent reared every time, unless I was imprinting an eagle for someone else and in truth I have only imprinted eagles because I love the progression from helpless downie through half downie/half feather to the real deal.Sharing that part of an eagles life is well worth doing. If I am ever lucky enough to breed from Cinnibar and Bentley my hope would be to let them rear a male eaglet and I would fly that eaglet for the rest of my days and may imprint a female and let a friend fly it.
ATB,
Neil.

Neil,

That's what I had read between the lines, but a fascinating and insightful answer. Thank you.

Iain

[SakerYZF]

If you need someone to come compensate for a broken/missing camera i'd be more than happy to help:-D

[Jastreb]

Neil, cos you are very experience with eagles and breeding, is it possibly to do voluntary insemination with eagles or not, and how much is percentage of fertile eggs if you are doing in that way?

Just curios :D sorry if is off topic!

Cheers Viktor

[Berkut]

Neil, cos you are very experience with eagles and breeding, is it possibly to do voluntary insemination with eagles or not, and how much is percentage of fertile eggs if you are doing in that way?

Just curios :D sorry if is off topic!

Cheers Viktor

Viktor,
AI is very successful with eagles.I haven't done it myself but all the eagles I fly were bred in this way. The percentage is pretty high.

ATB,
Neil.

[Jastreb]

Thanks a lot Neil :D

Cheers Viktor

[WildKestrel]

Hi Neil

Whats the progress with Spike? :) Any new pics? I'm getting withdrawal symptons, hehe.

:)

[Berkut]

Hi Neil

Whats the progress with Spike? :) Any new pics? I'm getting withdrawal symptons, hehe.

:)

Spike is doing pretty well. I am getting some aggression from him but it is minimal. I should have been on my proper hunting ground by now which would have meant channelling any aggression into hunting, but it has been delayed due to the grouse shooting being extended.

He topped out at just over 9 lbs but he is down below that at the moment.

Should have him hunting hard by the end of the month.

A couple of photos

[Salty]

belter mate :supz: :supz:

[TimDog80]

hes looking really good neil!!!!:supz:
hows he doing fitness wise?? and responsee??
how are you doing all the recalls at this stage with him being an imprint??

best regards
tim:D

p.s sorry if you have posted the info already but ive lost track with alot of the threads due to them being edited

[WildKestrel]

Glad to hear its looking more positive and loking forward to hearing about his hunting exploits when you manage to get to the grounds.
His looking beautiful.. :)

[Dr. David Glynne Fox]

Hi Neil,
Lovely bird Spike. I too am experiencing aggession from my male Star, he came at me yesterday, all guns blazing. I couldn't help thinking that if I had been someone who had only trained a Harris or suchlike, this would have been really intimidating. Actually, it was intimidating, but my own fault, I shouldn't have fed him at home, it is his territory, or he thinks it is. He is no problem out in the field but at home he yaps for Britain and gives me the evils. I have taken most of the summer to slowly bring him into condition so didn't really expect so much song and aggression. At 7lb 13 ozs he is lethal, but like you, have been too long in channelling the aggression into hunting, but will remedy this ASAP. At least, it is comforting to know that others are experiencing similar problems. I thought it was just me, never having had an eagle this young before, all my previous birds being imports. I have been considering letting someone else have him for a while to see if the problem subsides, and have also taken his weight up a bit. Like you, I think parent reared is the way forward. Mind you, I want him also for breeding with my female Skye, hence him being a partial imprint. At least, if she doesn't take to him at least I can use the AI route. All the best with him.
David

[Berkut]

Hi Neil,
Lovely bird Spike. I too am experiencing aggession from my male Star, he came at me yesterday, all guns blazing. I couldn't help thinking that if I had been someone who had only trained a Harris or suchlike, this would have been really intimidating. Actually, it was intimidating, but my own fault, I shouldn't have fed him at home, it is his territory, or he thinks it is. He is no problem out in the field but at home he yaps for Britain and gives me the evils. I have taken most of the summer to slowly bring him into condition so didn't really expect so much song and aggression. At 7lb 13 ozs he is lethal, but like you, have been too long in channelling the aggression into hunting, but will remedy this ASAP. At least, it is comforting to know that others are experiencing similar problems. I thought it was just me, never having had an eagle this young before, all my previous birds being imports. I have been considering letting someone else have him for a while to see if the problem subsides, and have also taken his weight up a bit. Like you, I think parent reared is the way forward. Mind you, I want him also for breeding with my female Skye, hence him being a partial imprint. At least, if she doesn't take to him at least I can use the AI route. All the best with him.
David


David,
We could swap the eagles for a few weeks if you like.That may solve the teething problems for both of us.

Neil.

[Dr. David Glynne Fox]

Hi Neil,
That may be a good idea. It seems a few others are having similar problems. I was watching Joe Atkinsons DVD earlier on hunting with his bird, Jackhammer. That bird is aggressive and also screams like hell, he is in adult plumage too, so it may be a good idea to nip all this in the bud if possible. No matter how long one flies eagles there is always something new to learn. Star is flying superbly but I think your idea of temporary ownership swap is sound, it may just work. He went through my gauntlet on Monday and the swelling is only just going down.
I am also using an upper arm protector, Falconiform sell them, and this has been a God-send. Goldie's tend to go for the left shoulder and upper arm, so this is a useful piece of kit in the armoury. Do you also give you eagles toys to play with? I always do. They are intelligent birds, as you well know. I give them tennis balls and other such things and they play for hours with them. They soon shred them however and need constant replacements, but I think they help. I learnt this from my first Goldie Sable. She found a wooden box and trashed it, so I gave her other similar items and she had a field day with them. I have continued the practice ever since and I am sure relieves the boredom factor if no-one is around. I add this as it may help others new to eagles.
Regards
David

[Pearl]

i found this did work with my bird david as she would get very aggressive on the pick up and putting her down to the perch on the garden here is a pic of her and her football she did kill it ,hope you dont mind neil mate :supz:

[TLDWB]

Elsa enjoys a game football as well.:D

Tom

[Berkut]

Elsa enjoys a game football as well.:D

Tom

Tom,
Thought you would have had her in a Rangers jersey.:D

[Gary F]

Elsa enjoys a game football as well.:D

Tom
nice to see a pic of elsa again, looking great,
thanks tom
atb gary

[TLDWB]

Tom,
Thought you would have had her in a Rangers jersey.:D

I might just get her one. To rip up!! :supz:

Tom

[Red Kite]

Hi Neil,
That may be a good idea. It seems a few others are having similar problems. I was watching Joe Atkinsons DVD earlier on hunting with his bird, Jackhammer. That bird is aggressive and also screams like hell, he is in adult plumage too, so it may be a good idea to nip all this in the bud if possible. No matter how long one flies eagles there is always something new to learn. Star is flying superbly but I think your idea of temporary ownership swap is sound, it may just work. He went through my gauntlet on Monday and the swelling is only just going down.
I am also using an upper arm protector, Falconiform sell them, and this has been a God-send. Goldie's tend to go for the left shoulder and upper arm, so this is a useful piece of kit in the armoury. Do you also give you eagles toys to play with? I always do. They are intelligent birds, as you well know. I give them tennis balls and other such things and they play for hours with them. They soon shred them however and need constant replacements, but I think they help. I learnt this from my first Goldie Sable. She found a wooden box and trashed it, so I gave her other similar items and she had a field day with them. I have continued the practice ever since and I am sure relieves the boredom factor if no-one is around. I add this as it may help others new to eagles.
Regards
David

Understanding eagle aggression remains an important challenge. Some birds are clearly tractable and calm, while others are problematic. There are great differences between species, and individuals. The situation is made all the more challenging due to the complexity and intelligence of many eagles. In all bird species the more intelligent they are the greater the possibility of behavioural problems.

A lot of the aggression we see with trained eagles is completely normal. The aggression that young imprint eagles display to their owners is likely to be the result of parent/offspring conflict that occurrs when eagles will be beginning to find their way in the wild and when adults and young will be aggressive to each other. With time the birds should, with careful handling grow out of this, and I suspect that handing the eagle to someone else to take through these difficult adolescent stages, away from its percieved parent, will help a great deal.

Some eagles become very aggressive when offered large amounts of food on the fist and I suspect this is a problem because they see the handler as being in possession of the food and they want to get it off them. This is what is seen with wild eagles that will attack to drive each other off food. Eagles unlike smaller birds of prey, have a capacity to bond more closely to the falconer which it may view as a conspecific, and hence even some passage females will solicit to the falconer for copulation, as indeed will Witch to me.

The imprinting of eagles is something not to be taken lightly. There are clearly many who have a deep and intuitive understanding of their bird's needs and do a great job, while many are stabbing in the dark. Imprinting and mal-imprinting are probably the most misused words in the falconry lexicon. When we imprint a bird we take it through its formitive early learning period and should try to programme in a series of desirable behaviours.

During its early learning the young eagle is doing a great deal more than imprinting, it is developing a range of social behaviours, food preferences and hunting behaviours, how to fly and interact with the wind, developing its muscles and its perceptual systems and developing its temprement and intellectual ability. All of these are being developed during windows of time when the bird will be most receptive. It is the role of the trainer to ensure that the bird is developing these behaviours at the most appropriate time.

In the larger eagles because of their complexity and intelligence, coupled with their long developmental periods, the chances of screwing up the social and behaviour development of the bird are much greater. Imprinting in eagles is a much more complex process than in falcons or accipiters.

Fail to socialise the bird at the correct time or to allow it to develop its behaviours appropriately and there are chances of retarding the bird's behaviour. Socialise or train incorrectly and you have classic "mal-imprinting".

Many captive breeding enclosures and hand rearing facilities are akin to deprivation chambers. The young bird growing in a low stimulus environment is in danger of being neurotic, nervous and a mere shadow of the bird it should be.

My parent raised female hybrid Golden Eagle "Witch" shows classic signs of poor and incorrect early learning having been inappropriately handled by a former owner(s)(?) and is nervous and inclined to be highly strung. She was also I suspect fed large amounts of food on the glove, and likely robbed of food, since she now attacks the glove, and as PitBullOne suggests she probably sees the glove as prey.

Aggression towards me by Witch is made a lot worse if she is called back for a lot of food. Hence I call her back for a single day old chick that I throw onto the ground and in any flying session making her work for her rewards helps, calling her back several time in quick succession can make her crabby. Feeding high fat or high calorie foods can make her more difficult to handle. Try and do too much with her and making her over tired in a session can bring on tantrums. I fly at 3.9-4.1 kg. and flying weights below 3.9 causes and increase in aggression over food.

Witch becomes hormonal in the spring and to a lesser extent in the autumn when she will greet me with a quieter "erreeep-erreeep" call rather than her usual occassional yelp. When she is hormonal she can be very dangerous and may fly at my legs if she is on the ground or occassionally she flies at me and at the last minute clamps onto the upraised glove.

During her non-hormonal times she is (above precautions applied) a delight to own and fly.

I have enjoyed the comments in this, and other similar threads on the socialisation of eagles and I offer these thoughts as mere ideas as a means of stimulating discussion on an important topic. The future of safe and enjoyable falconry with these birds is dependent on a better understanding of what makes them tick.

[HawkEagle]

I have trained many eagles and I can say that most of bad traits are very difficult to correct and some will be imposible to do. Therefore good early bonding is a must when working with eagle. It's a long term commitment. Training should progress slowly and surely, should there be any problem it can be corrected easily. The worst one I trained was a mountain hawk eagle that has been placed in a little cage for a few years and regularly get poked from kids. This bird is agressive and no matter how hard I tried he will never give in.

[Berkut]

Understanding eagle aggression remains an important challenge. Some birds are clearly tractable and calm, while others are problematic. There are great differences between species, and individuals. The situation is made all the more challenging due to the complexity and intelligence of many eagles. In all bird species the more intelligent they are the greater the possibility of behavioural problems.

A lot of the aggression we see with trained eagles is completely normal. The aggression that young imprint eagles display to their owners is likely to be the result of parent/offspring conflict that occurrs when eagles will be beginning to find their way in the wild and when adults and young will be aggressive to each other. With time the birds should, with careful handling grow out of this, and I suspect that handing the eagle to someone else to take through these difficult adolescent stages, away from its percieved parent, will help a great deal.

Some eagles become very aggressive when offered large amounts of food on the fist and I suspect this is a problem because they see the handler as being in possession of the food and they want to get it off them. This is what is seen with wild eagles that will attack to drive each other off food. Eagles unlike smaller birds of prey, have a capacity to bond more closely to the falconer which it may view as a conspecific, and hence even some passage females will solicit to the falconer for copulation, as indeed will Witch to me.

The imprinting of eagles is something not to be taken lightly. There are clearly many who have a deep and intuitive understanding of their bird's needs and do a great job, while many are stabbing in the dark. Imprinting and mal-imprinting are probably the most misused words in the falconry lexicon. When we imprint a bird we take it through its formitive early learning period and should try to programme in a series of desirable behaviours.

During its early learning the young eagle is doing a great deal more than imprinting, it is developing a range of social behaviours, food preferences and hunting behaviours, how to fly and interact with the wind, developing its muscles and its perceptual systems and developing its temprement and intellectual ability. All of these are being developed during windows of time when the bird will be most receptive. It is the role of the trainer to ensure that the bird is developing these behaviours at the most appropriate time.

In the larger eagles because of their complexity and intelligence, coupled with their long developmental periods, the chances of screwing up the social and behaviour development of the bird are much greater. Imprinting in eagles is a much more complex process than in falcons or accipiters.

Fail to socialise the bird at the correct time or to allow it to develop its behaviours appropriately and there are chances of retarding the bird's behaviour. Socialise or train incorrectly and you have classic "mal-imprinting".

Many captive breeding enclosures and hand rearing facilities are akin to deprivation chambers. The young bird growing in a low stimulus environment is in danger of being neurotic, nervous and a mere shadow of the bird it should be.

My parent raised female hybrid Golden Eagle "Witch" shows classic signs poor and incorrect early learning having been inappropriately handled by a former owner(s)(?) and is nervous and inclined to be highly strung. She was also I suspect fed large amounts of food on the glove, and likely robbed of food, since she now attacks the glove, and as PitBullOne suggests she probably sees the glove as prey.

Aggression towards me by Witch is made a lot worse if she is called back for a lot of food. Hence I call her back for a single day old chick that I throw onto the ground and in any flying session making her work for her rewards helps, calling her back several time in quick succession can make her crabby. Feeding high fat or high calorie foods can make her more difficult to handle. Try and do too much with her and making her over tired in a session can bring on tantrums. I fly at 3.9-4.1 kg. and flying weights below 3.9 causes and increase in aggression over food.

Witch becomes hormonal in the spring and to a lesser extent in the autumn when she will greet me with a quieter "erreeep-erreeep" call rather than her usual occassional yelp. When she is hormonal she can be very dangerous and may fly at my legs if she is on the ground or occassionally she flies at me and at the last minute clamps onto the upraised glove.

During her non-hormonal times she is (above precautions applied) a delight to own and fly.

I have enjoyed the comments in this, and other similar threads on the socialisation of eagles and I offer these thoughts as mere ideas as a means of stimulating discussion on an important topic. The future of safe and enjoyable falconry with these birds is dependent on a better understanding of what makes them tick.

Good post.Thanks for taking the time to compose it. A lot of very valid points.
Although aggression can come at various times and at various stages,the vast majority of aggression is food related. It amazes me how many people feed eagles large amounts of food on the glove. Initially I feed zero food on the glove and once the initial bond and routine are in place I will allow the eagle to come to the fist for a chicks head or leg and no more.

In the older books flying eagles is rubbished because of the aggression, and often there is talk of wearing fencing masks and the like. These eagles were nearly always openly fed by the handler from a very young age and often the aggression is minimal until weight is reduced and then the real problems start.

[Red Kite]

Good post.Thanks for taking the time to compose it. A lot of very valid points.
Although aggression can come at various times and at various stages,the vast majority of aggression is food related. It amazes me how many people feed eagles large amounts of food on the glove. Initially I feed zero food on the glove and once the initial bond and routine are in place I will allow the eagle to come to the fist for a chicks head or leg and no more.

In the older books flying eagles is rubbished because of the aggression, and often there is talk of wearing fencing masks and the like. These eagles were nearly always openly fed by the handler from a very young age and often the aggression is minimal until weight is reduced and then the real problems start.

Thanks for this, I still find it amazing that Golden Eagles are so aggressive when fed on the fist. Herein lies the contadiction that we train the birds using food rewards but have to make sure the birds do not associate us with large amounts of food! Interesting to know how most people flying Golden Eagles manage this contradiction. :?:

[Berkut]

Excess fist feeding in my opinion can cause problems with most birds of prey but with eagles, their sheer size and the damage they can potentially inflict magnifies the problem.
My solution isn,t necessarily the best one but it certainly seems to work for me. I can open up kills bare handed without worry of the eagle turning on me. I think although there has to be some degree of food association I try and strike a balance where I set myself up as a hunting partner to the eagle and that is exactly what he sees me as.

Neil.

[Gary F]

Hi Neil,
That may be a good idea. It seems a few others are having similar problems. I was watching Joe Atkinsons DVD earlier on hunting with his bird, Jackhammer.
Regards
David
david
what did you think off the ground/area he was flying his eagle? looked like an industrial estate,nothing like we think eagles should be flown on,
Cant think who or where i heard it, the stuffed golden eagle they have/had in wolloton hall ,was one off yours?
atb gary

[TLDWB]

Looks like this threads been slightly hijacked. Just thought i would give my opinion on this. I do have to agree with most points said on hear, the only aggression I have had around eagles, is all to do with food. As I have mentioned before Elsa is never feed from the fist, but after she has fed on the ground on her recall piece, she can still hit the fist hard when jumping up. This is something that will probably always remain with her time will tell, not that I see this as a problem. Its all about channeling the aggression, which eagles have in plenty, as Neil has said you what to be a hunting partner, not just seen as a bringer(supplier) of the food. This is a good topic on its own, hope it continues, feed up typing for now.

Tom

[Dr. David Glynne Fox]

david
what did you think off the ground/area he was flying his eagle? looked like an industrial estate,nothing like we think eagles should be flown on,
Cant think who or where i heard it, the stuffed golden eagle they have/had in wolloton hall ,was one off yours?
atb gary

Hi Gary,
The industrial area was not the most scenic I have ever seen, but it held the quarry, which is most important. The stuffed Golden Eagle in Wollaton Hall is not one of mine.Fortunately, I have yet to have a Goldie die on me and wish to keep that record if at all possible.
All the best
David

[Dr. David Glynne Fox]

i found this did work with my bird david as she would get very aggressive on the pick up and putting her down to the perch on the garden here is a pic of her and her football she did kill it ,hope you dont mind neil mate :supz:

Thanks for the reply. It would be great to be able to get all this information down in book form, not only to help newcomers but us old timers as well. It is very encouraging to hear that a temporary swap helped with your bird. Lovely eagle by the wat=y.
Regards
David

[Dr. David Glynne Fox]

Understanding eagle aggression remains an important challenge. Some birds are clearly tractable and calm, while others are problematic. There are great differences between species, and individuals. The situation is made all the more challenging due to the complexity and intelligence of many eagles. In all bird species the more intelligent they are the greater the possibility of behavioural problems.

A lot of the aggression we see with trained eagles is completely normal. The aggression that young imprint eagles display to their owners is likely to be the result of parent/offspring conflict that occurrs when eagles will be beginning to find their way in the wild and when adults and young will be aggressive to each other. With time the birds should, with careful handling grow out of this, and I suspect that handing the eagle to someone else to take through these difficult adolescent stages, away from its percieved parent, will help a great deal.

Some eagles become very aggressive when offered large amounts of food on the fist and I suspect this is a problem because they see the handler as being in possession of the food and they want to get it off them. This is what is seen with wild eagles that will attack to drive each other off food. Eagles unlike smaller birds of prey, have a capacity to bond more closely to the falconer which it may view as a conspecific, and hence even some passage females will solicit to the falconer for copulation, as indeed will Witch to me.

The imprinting of eagles is something not to be taken lightly. There are clearly many who have a deep and intuitive understanding of their bird's needs and do a great job, while many are stabbing in the dark. Imprinting and mal-imprinting are probably the most misused words in the falconry lexicon. When we imprint a bird we take it through its formitive early learning period and should try to programme in a series of desirable behaviours.

During its early learning the young eagle is doing a great deal more than imprinting, it is developing a range of social behaviours, food preferences and hunting behaviours, how to fly and interact with the wind, developing its muscles and its perceptual systems and developing its temprement and intellectual ability. All of these are being developed during windows of time when the bird will be most receptive. It is the role of the trainer to ensure that the bird is developing these behaviours at the most appropriate time.

In the larger eagles because of their complexity and intelligence, coupled with their long developmental periods, the chances of screwing up the social and behaviour development of the bird are much greater. Imprinting in eagles is a much more complex process than in falcons or accipiters.

Fail to socialise the bird at the correct time or to allow it to develop its behaviours appropriately and there are chances of retarding the bird's behaviour. Socialise or train incorrectly and you have classic "mal-imprinting".

Many captive breeding enclosures and hand rearing facilities are akin to deprivation chambers. The young bird growing in a low stimulus environment is in danger of being neurotic, nervous and a mere shadow of the bird it should be.

My parent raised female hybrid Golden Eagle "Witch" shows classic signs of poor and incorrect early learning having been inappropriately handled by a former owner(s)(?) and is nervous and inclined to be highly strung. She was also I suspect fed large amounts of food on the glove, and likely robbed of food, since she now attacks the glove, and as PitBullOne suggests she probably sees the glove as prey.

Aggression towards me by Witch is made a lot worse if she is called back for a lot of food. Hence I call her back for a single day old chick that I throw onto the ground and in any flying session making her work for her rewards helps, calling her back several time in quick succession can make her crabby. Feeding high fat or high calorie foods can make her more difficult to handle. Try and do too much with her and making her over tired in a session can bring on tantrums. I fly at 3.9-4.1 kg. and flying weights below 3.9 causes and increase in aggression over food.

Witch becomes hormonal in the spring and to a lesser extent in the autumn when she will greet me with a quieter "erreeep-erreeep" call rather than her usual occassional yelp. When she is hormonal she can be very dangerous and may fly at my legs if she is on the ground or occassionally she flies at me and at the last minute clamps onto the upraised glove.

During her non-hormonal times she is (above precautions applied) a delight to own and fly.

I have enjoyed the comments in this, and other similar threads on the socialisation of eagles and I offer these thoughts as mere ideas as a means of stimulating discussion on an important topic. The future of safe and enjoyable falconry with these birds is dependent on a better understanding of what makes them tick.
A lot of good and relevent points here. Most aggression does seem to come from feeding regimes and generally from feeding large amounts of food on the glove. I have avoided this with almost clinical precision. I have raised Star's weight and the aggression and yapping have ceased, but I expect a return as his weight subsides. I think a brief stay with Neil may be the answer, while I ponder what I did wrong. Maybe I did nothing wrong, perhaps he is just one of those intelligent eagles, but as you correctly state, this is a harsh time in their lives when they are learning in overdrive and aggression is something that does indeed surface naturally. This thread is becoming quite scientific and very inspiring.
Thanks for the input.
Regards
David

[Hacker]

I have to agree and the more eagle info that can be assimilated the better as this seems the least documented due to the lack of eagle flyers in this country.
Mind you, the numbers are increasing yearly which should be good for the sport if flown responsibly and this is where exchange of info is crucial to fostering an uptake of falconers willing to take on one of these fabulous and demanding birds.

[Dr. David Glynne Fox]

I have trained many eagles and I can say that most of bad traits are very difficult to correct and some will be imposible to do. Therefore good early bonding is a must when working with eagle. It's a long term commitment. Training should progress slowly and surely, should there be any problem it can be corrected easily. The worst one I trained was a mountain hawk eagle that has been placed in a little cage for a few years and regularly get poked from kids. This bird is agressive and no matter how hard I tried he will never give in.

All very true.I always take my time bringing eagles into condition. They are like elephants, they never forget, and often never forgive. Crowned Eagles, if history is anything to go by, never having had the good fortune to own one, do seem to exhibit a lot of aggression. It was a breath of fresh air to hear how yours is doing. Wonderful bird and good luck.
David

[TLDWB]

Hi Gary,
The industrial area was not the most scenic I have ever seen, but it held the quarry, which is most important. The stuffed Golden Eagle in Wollaton Hall is not one of mine.Fortunately, I have yet to have a Goldie die on me and wish to keep that record if at all possible.
All the best
David

David, is this DVD worth watching, seems to know his stuff.

Tom

[Red Kite]

All very true.I always take my time bringing eagles into condition. They are like elephants, they never forget, and often never forgive. Crowned Eagles, if history is anything to go by, never having had the good fortune to own one, do seem to exhibit a lot of aggression. It was a breath of fresh air to hear how yours is doing. Wonderful bird and good luck.
David

Aggression that trained birds may show to their handlers is in the Accipitriformes in direct relation to the degree of rapacity the species shows. Hence a goshawk shows more aggression than a buzzard and a buzzard is more crabby than a kite. Applying this principle Tawny eagles should be more placid than Golden Eagles and as Dr Fox tells us the highly rapacious Crowned Eagle is going to be more aggressive than a Golden Eagle. Although as in all species you get some individuals that are more tractable and placid than others.

Curious how there are two Dr Foxes on the British falconry scene and both have written falconry books.

[Dr. David Glynne Fox]

David, is this DVD worth watching, seems to know his stuff.

Tom

This DVD is certainly worth watching, Joe Atkinson has been flying Goldies all his life and his birds certainly take quarry well, although there is almost nothing concerning the training of eagles, which virtually all books and films concerning eagles severely lack. Most are primarily concerned with the finished article, which is a shame, as great opportunities to help others have been neglected. I learnt the hard way because when I began flying eagles in the early 1960's, you could count the number of eagle falconers on one hand. There was virtually no-one you could ask for advice and nothing in the literature that could be of any real help. The situation is slowly improving and this forum simply has to the best current source for advice worldwide, I know I have learnt from others on this site. Keep up the informative posts, nothing can be achieved by keeping sound advice to one's self, particularly where eagles are concerned as in the wrong hands, these big and powerful birds can be alarming to their owners and I see few prospects in having to keep on re-inventing the wheel. For myself, I am beginnig to understand a lot more about the various types of imprinting and their possible future effects, but I feel we are in our infancy here. It will take some time before all this is properly understood, so it is heartening to see that some with more experience than other in this field are sharing their views and experiences for the benefit of all, especially the birds themselves.
Regards to all
David

[J.P]

An incredible thread,feeding my addiction to read about various aspects of falconry. As a complete begginer, this thread embodies everything you could hope from this forum. As educational as it is captivating.

All the best Neil, hope Spike and the others continue to improve.
Jamie

[unicinctusy]

how goes it with the baby...regards

[Berkut]

how goes it with the baby...regards

Spike is doing really well at the moment.He is very well adjusted in most situations. I am just waiting for access to my land in the next 10 days or so and then it will be full steam ahead.
I sit in the semi dark for an hour every night with him in the garden and it is a real privelage as he sits preening with one foot tucked up.
I'll post a couple of photos tomorrow.

Neil.

[PitBullOne]

Thanks for this, I still find it amazing that Golden Eagles are so aggressive when fed on the fist. Herein lies the contadiction that we train the birds using food rewards but have to make sure the birds do not associate us with large amounts of food! Interesting to know how most people flying Golden Eagles manage this contradiction. :?:

sorry m8 if this sounds critical but i just looked at your public profile and it says you fly a goldie hybrid,i find i a worry you do not know the answer to this question,how are you treaining and flying your bird,if you dont know the basics,i beleive we are so close to aserious accident with an eagle

[Red Kite]

sorry m8 if this sounds critical but i just looked at your public profile and it says you fly a goldie hybrid,i find i a worry you do not know the answer to this question,how are you treaining and flying your bird,if you dont know the basics,i beleive we are so close to aserious accident with an eagle

Many thanks for you comment. I do not feed my eagle on the fist. I was following through on a discussion concerning aggression in eagles and I had posed some of my views (#877). If you read back through the thread you will see I was asking a question hoping that I would get some insight from those with lots of experience with Golden Eagles like yourself. You will see I quote and agree with some of your previous comments. I have no illusions about how how to handle and manage these birds. I was pointing out what may seem like a contradiction on the use of food in training.

[PitBullOne]

Many thanks for you comment. I do not feed my eagle on the fist. I was following through on a discussion concerning aggression in eagles and I had posed some of my views (#877). If you read back through the thread you will see I was asking a question hoping that I would get some insight from those with lots of experience with Golden Eagles like yourself. You will see I quote and agree with some of your previous comments. I have no illusions about how how to handle and manage these birds. I was pointing out what may seem like a contradiction on the use of food in training.

sorry if i sounded negative,i am genuinely concerned ,about the no of eagles sat in aviaries with no real hope of hunting,beingkept as some sort of fashion statement or penis exstension,may i add that last remark was in no way directed at yourself,but drawn from my experiences over the last couple of years,in europe some of the best eagle falconers,feed there birds by hand and use methods we would consider lunacy,but they eventually turn these birds into steady non aggressive birds,the bird socialisation is intensive,and they are got going early,so they know there direction,and dont get confused as to the role of the falconer as a hunting partner rather than rival

[Red Kite]

sorry if i sounded negative,i am genuinely concerned ,about the no of eagles sat in aviaries with no real hope of hunting,beingkept as some sort of fashion statement or penis exstension,may i add that last remark was in no way directed at yourself,but drawn from my experiences over the last couple of years,in europe some of the best eagle falconers,feed there birds by hand and use methods we would consider lunacy,but they eventually turn these birds into steady non aggressive birds,the bird socialisation is intensive,and they are got going early,so they know there direction,and dont get confused as to the role of the falconer as a hunting partner rather than rival

Many thanks, I share your views, we are on the same wavelength. I responded to some comments by Niel and Dr Fox about aggression and merely wanted to air my experiences and thoughts, although I now appreciate I did go on a bit and wandered off the mark. However like, Berkut, you and others I want eagles to be better understood and managed. I have discussed my eagle with you before and she was discussed in the thread on Goldie X Steppe hybrids. See my account of her there #76. She gets flown regularly (daily) for much of the year and I am fortunate that she can be flown around my home since I live in the middle of a sheep farm with no near neighbours.

I am in danger of hijacking Berkuts thread (sorry Niel) and perhaps if we want to carry on this and related discussions we should transfer it to Dr Fox's thread on Training Eagles which is a more appropriate thread for our discussion.

[Berkut]

Great results with Spike today. I am doing rope training with him,but this is limited due to the fact that I am keeping his weight high at the moment. The reasoning behind this is to fly him at hares on appetite,gauging his response and reducing his weight as I "fly him into condition" over a period of time (and a prolonged one if necessary).

Today I did some rope work ,10 reps to 10 half chicks. I then set out a rabbit carcass(freshly caught by the gos and still hot). Spike flew to it without hesitation and within a short time was feeding well on it. I crept in slowly and he never mantled and let me in about his feet with zero aggression while I fiddled with the rabbit. I then put a chick 2 feet from the rabbit and he casually left the rabbit,walked over to the chick and started eating it. I put the rabbit 20 yards away and when he finished the chick he flew over to the rabbit again. I repeated this process 5 times,finally trading the rabbit for a whole quail.Again he transferred without aggression.I bagged the rabbit and then crawled in beside him while he finished the quail. He then jumped up onto the bare glove,feaked,roused and I hooded him.

I dare say it won't always be this good, but it was very rewarding considering the time I have put into him and the concerns I have had in the past.

[RedNoseK9]

neil sounds like things are heading in the right direction now mate cant wait to get geisha up and going and pop and see you :yawinkle:

[Berkut]

neil sounds like things are heading in the right direction now mate cant wait to get geisha up and going and pop and see you :yawinkle:

Look forward to it Wez.

[Richard]

Great results with Spike today. I am doing rope training with him,but this is limited due to the fact that I am keeping his weight high at the moment. The reasoning behind this is to fly him at hares on appetite,gauging his response and reducing his weight as I "fly him into condition" over a period of time (and a prolonged one if necessary).

Today I did some rope work ,10 reps to 10 half chicks. I then set out a rabbit carcass(freshly caught by the gos and still hot). Spike flew to it without hesitation and within a short time was feeding well on it. I crept in slowly and he never mantled and let me in about his feet with zero aggression while I fiddled with the rabbit. I then put a chick 2 feet from the rabbit and he casually left the rabbit,walked over to the chick and started eating it. I put the rabbit 20 yards away and when he finished the chick he flew over to the rabbit again. I repeated this process 5 times,finally trading the rabbit for a whole quail.Again he transferred without aggression.I bagged the rabbit and then crawled in beside him while he finished the quail. He then jumped up onto the bare glove,feaked,roused and I hooded him.

I dare say it won't always be this good, but it was very rewarding considering the time I have put into him and the concerns I have had in the past.

Good stuff Neil, Did you use the same methods with elsa at this stage of training?

Richard

[JoHo]

Hi Neil,

really pleased to hear your news. That must feel really good to have him so chilled out, but still keen. Can't wait to see the next instalment

Johann

[Berkut]

Good stuff Neil, Did you use the same methods with elsa at this stage of training?

Richard

Richard,
Elsa was with someone else by this time but I think there are similarities. I will be checking with Tommy soon.

Neil.

[goshawker 4]

looking good mate i wont one but dont have the land + money for a beast like that!!!:supz: :supz: :cry:

[Sarah J]

Pics!! We need more pics!!! :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart:

[Alan G]

Brilliant Neil, a great reinforcement for the two of you.

I know, but if it only could go as easy as today, everytime.

Look forward to seeing a wee photo update, especially after seeing on here how Floyd is looking (age comparison, plumage etc).

ATVB

[Austringer84]

So pleased mate, hope all goes well.

si

[Laggan]

...........
Today I did some rope work ,10 reps to 10 half chicks. I then set out a rabbit carcass(freshly caught by the gos and still hot). Spike flew to it without hesitation and within a short time was feeding well on it. I crept in slowly and he never mantled and let me in about his feet with zero aggression while I fiddled with the rabbit. I then put a chick 2 feet from the rabbit and he casually left the rabbit,walked over to the chick and started eating it. I put the rabbit 20 yards away and when he finished the chick he flew over to the rabbit again. I repeated this process 5 times,finally trading the rabbit for a whole quail.Again he transferred without aggression.I bagged the rabbit and then crawled in beside him while he finished the quail. He then jumped up onto the bare glove,feaked,roused and I hooded him.


Neil,

very interesting post this given the 'sibling rivalry'-based aggression you experienced with Spike a seemingly short while ago. I would be interested in your thoughts as to why Spike behaved aggressively earlier but not in this exchange situation. Is this related to territory at all, in that the home environment he regards as his own turf, so-to-speak? I can rationalise improved behaviour through repetition, but this excellent position you have established seems relatively early to have resulted from repetition.

Iin the absence of putting Spike out "on holiday" his behaviour even in a relatively threatening environment seems to have come on in leaps-and-bounds. Really pleased for the relationship, just trying to better understand the reasoning.

Thanks for your thoughts.

Iain

[Berkut]

Neil,

very interesting post this given the 'sibling rivalry'-based aggression you experienced with Spike a seemingly short while ago. I would be interested in your thoughts as to why Spike behaved aggressively earlier but not in this exchange situation. Is this related to territory at all, in that the home environment he regards as his own turf, so-to-speak? I can rationalise improved behaviour through repetition, but this excellent position you have established seems relatively early to have resulted from repetition.

Iin the absence of putting Spike out "on holiday" his behaviour even in a relatively threatening environment seems to have come on in leaps-and-bounds. Really pleased for the relationship, just trying to better understand the reasoning.

Thanks for your thoughts.

Iain


Iain,
I am at a loss as to how he has turned around in such a relatively short space of time. I have been pondering it since I posted.Often I do what I do sub-consciously so it does take a bit of working out at times.
Ultimately I spend a lot of time with him and feeding is just a small proportion of that time and he still has never seen me supply the food but I am present during feedtimes.

It could still go belly -up, but for the time being I am encouraged with the progress.
Access to my ground is soon, and I do feel flying him very hard at hares as his weight comes down is the way forward.

Hope this makes sense.

Neil.

[Laggan]

Iain,
I am at a loss as to how he has turned around in such a relatively short space of time. I have been pondering it since I posted.Often I do what I do sub-consciously so it does take a bit of working out at times.
Ultimately I spend a lot of time with him and feeding is just a small proportion of that time and he still has never seen me supply the food but I am present during feedtimes.

It could still go belly -up, but for the time being I am encouraged with the progress.
Access to my ground is soon, and I do feel flying him very hard at hares as his weight comes down is the way forward.

Hope this makes sense.

Neil.

Neil,

I appreciate the honesty of your answer in that you cannot fully rationalise it for yourself. As you say, it may be down to the impercetible sub-conscious things you do. Not comparing myself to you, but I am forever trying to examine things in minutae to understand what action, or lack-of-action, may have caused, or failed, to give a predictable response. I think falconry is very much a 'thinking' passion.

But I suspect that there is sill much to learn about maturation and behavioural issues in raptors, not just eagles, even if issues with eagles may be magnified. In many ways, long may it remain so - it would be a little sad to me if we ever truly unlocked all of these developmental mysteries, as there would be nothing left to learn.

Irrespective of the reasoning for this behavioural change, it seems to be setting good foundations and augurs well when you have to exchange for quarry that Spike has caught for himself.

I don't mind remaining somewhat mystified, I am just delighted for you.

Speak soon.

Iain

[Berkut]

Neil,

I appreciate the honesty of your answer in that you cannot fully rationalise it for yourself. As you say, it may be down to the impercetible sub-conscious things you do. Not comparing myself to you, but I am forever trying to examine things in minutae to understand what action, or lack-of-action, may have caused, or failed, to give a predictable response. I think falconry is very much a 'thinking' passion.

But I suspect that there is sill much to learn about maturation and behavioural issues in raptors, not just eagles, even if issues with eagles may be magnified. In many ways, long may it remain so - it would be a little sad to me if we ever truly unlocked all of these developmental mysteries, as there would be nothing left to learn.

Irrespective of the reasoning for this behavioural change, it seems to be setting good foundations and augurs well when you have to exchange for quarry that Spike has caught for himself.

I don't mind remaining somewhat mystified, I am just delighted for you.

Speak soon.

Iain

Good post Iain. I am always asking questions and learning something new every day.Long may it continue.

Neil

[KiteTrainer]

Good post Iain. I am always asking questions and learning something new every day.Long may it continue.

Neil

Nothing like being honest(every day is a school day with Eagles) thats for sure:supz:

[Berkut]

Bright sunshine today and zero wind.Perfect for my ground. Bentley was bang on weight but I felt I should devote a day to Spike so I did some rope work with Bentley and fed him to take temptation out the way.

Spike weighed in at 8lb 8 oz.

I was on the ground by 1130hrs and to give Spike the best chance I decided to walk with him unhooded,providing he behaved,which he did.
I had only been walking for a few minutes when the first hare flushed.No hesitation as he burst after it.He made good ground and was pumping hard as he went in for the kill,but the hare jinked at the last moment,leaving him bewildered in the heather. Over the next while he had another 5 or 6 good slips,flying hard after these "easy":weedman: hares but they avoided him at the last gasp,although on a couple of occasions the lack of success was down to him not putting his feet down when the hare would normally have been in the bag. Gradual weight reduction gauged on performance will sort that out.

Next time out (which might be tomorrow) if he is unsuccessful after a few slips I will set him up with an easy one in long heather to boost his confidence,
but it won't be long now.

I was very pleased with him today ( he done well good ,as they say.:))

Neil

[Hardcore Hawker]

Superb Neil, let the photos commence, and have a great season, All the Best Steve.

[RedNoseK9]

Sounds like a great day neil and he seems to be finding his feet a bit nice one

Wez

[Laggan]

Neil,

sounds very encouraging. Can you give some idea of the length of these slips and, given that he is an imprint, will you be flying him on a mixture of weight and appetite?

Thanks.

Iain

[Berkut]

Neil,

sounds very encouraging. Can you give some idea of the length of these slips and, given that he is an imprint, will you be flying him on a mixture of weight and appetite?

Thanks.

Iain

Iain,
The closest slip would have been about 30 yards and the furthest was over 100yds. I will fly him on appetite, but weight will have to be reduced to a degree.I don't see him comimg much below 8lbs though.

ATB,
Neil.

[KiteTrainer]

Good stuff today Neil, pity some of us have got to work, roll on till I can get a couple of muggings in the bag it will be well good:supz:

[Berkut]

Superb Neil, let the photos commence, and have a great season, All the Best Steve.

Sounds like a great day neil and he seems to be finding his feet a bit nice one

Wez

Thanks.Took the camera but left it in the jeep,although when I got back I took one of him sitting in the heather which I may post.

Neil

[TinvinPeregrine]

nice one :supz:

[Berkut]

Not much but it was taken today.

[TimDog80]

good to hear mate:D
roll on his first kill:supz:

[Berkut]

Spike's First Hare

Once again today the weather was perfect for flying the eagles on my ground. These are the type of days that Bentley loves and a full game bag is guaranteed.
I decided that as Spike came so close yesterday, I owed him another day to himself .
He weighed in at 8lb 7.5 oz , half an ounce down on yesterday.

I was on the ground for 1330hrs. 15 minutes later Spike was powering off the fist after a hare.He close the gap in no time ,but when the hare was there for the taking he never dropped his feet. This was pretty much the order of the day ,although the flights were worth the watching.

His last flight but one, a hare burst over 100 yards away down the valley. Spike really gave it his all and this time his feet went
down, but the hare jinked at the last minute,doubling back across the valley bottom. Spike carried on flying and landed well up the opposite hillside. His feet had barely touched the ground when he took off again for another go at the same hare.
The hare had 150 yards start on this occasion,but Spike closed the gap, running out of steam as the hare reached the opposite hillside.

All of a sudden a real chill set in and it became dull. I decided to head back to the jeep which was about a mile away. I was nearly there when a hare burst slightly uphill and then cut right onto a stretch of burnt heather. Spike didn't hesitate and powered off the fist. He made good ground and at the point he looked like he may not drop his feet,the hare seemed to lose its footing slightly and I saw a different Spike as he seemed to sense the vulnerability and slammed into the hare at full tilt. It wasn't the best flight I have seen ,but it was far from easy and the decent cropfull of hot hare was well earned. I felt a real sense of achievement after all the ups and downs I have had with him. Although this is only the start for Spike and there is still a long way to go I feel I may have cracked it this time.

My son came out for the day and took some photos

[RedNoseK9]

Really enjoying the turn this story is taking and he looks great a few succesfull days in a row and he should start to get more focused so a great season is in order i feel nice one neil

Wez

[SparsTheOne]

outstanding mate:supz::supz::supz::supz:


jase.

[KiteTrainer]

Good stuff Neil a good reward for all your time and effort. People can only imagine the commitment

[Stav]

excellent stuff look forward to more posts and pics well done neil and spike

[Alan G]

Good effort Neil and nice to hear that all your hard work is beginning to pay you back in a positive manner.

Spike is looking great in those photo's and hope you all enjoyed your day.

Cheers

[Berkut]

I like to compare8-)

[Cyclone]

:supz::supz: wel done been waiting to hear that for ages:supz:
Shane

[TimDog80]

good for you mate:supz:
glad all the hard work and dedication you have put into him is starting to pay off for you!!!......keep it up as im sure you will:yawinkle:

best regards
tim:D

[Laggan]

Neil,

many congratulations - it has been a long and at times difficult journey but your Post 930 summed up what must have been a very proud moment for you.

I was wondering whether his behaviour around the kill was as good as the picture suggested or any hint of aggression/'rivalry'?

Iain

[Berkut]

Neil,

many congratulations - it has been a long and at times difficult journey but your Post 930 summed up what must have been a very proud moment for you.

I was wondering whether his behaviour around the kill was as good as the picture suggested or any hint of aggression/'rivalry'?

Iain

Good question Iain. Initially while on the hare ,which unusually for an eagle I had to secure and despatch,he was great. After the initial excitement was over he left the hare and charged at my son. This aggression lasted for a few seconds,after which he returned to the hare and was a dream,with his wings held tight against his body. Once I felt he had eaten enough from the hare (huge bulging crops are unnecessary) I put 2 chicks to his side.He stepped off the hare,which I put into the gamebag,and ate the chicks.He then stepped up onto the glove,feaked,roused,muted and I popped his hood on.

I don't know who was more satisfied,me or Spike.;)

[TimDog80]

Good question Iain. Initially while on the hare ,which unusually for an eagle I had to secure and despatch,he was great. After the initial excitement was over he left the hare and charged at my son. This aggression lasted for a few seconds,after which he returned to the hare and was a dream,with his wings held tight against his body. Once I felt he had eaten enough from the hare (huge bulging crops are unnecessary) I put 2 chicks to his side.He stepped off the hare,which I put into the gamebag,and ate the chicks.He then stepped up onto the glove,feaked,roused,muted and I popped his hood on.

I don't know who was more satisfied,me or Spike.;)
what was your sons response neil?............i take it he knows the score then does he?

[PaulWar3]

Good stuff Neil.:supz: First of many no doubt.

Paul

[Berkut]

what was your sons response neil?............i take it he knows the score then does he?

He got a fright.I couldn't do anything for laughing.He wasn't pleased at first but he saw the funny side later, once he had cleaned the puncture marks on his legs and changed his boxers.:twisted::lol:

[KiteTrainer]

He got a fright.I couldn't do anything for laughing.He wasn't pleased at first but he saw the funny side later, once he had cleaned the puncture marks on his legs and changed his boxers.:twisted::lol:


Neil. I nearly wet myself when I read this, adrenaline is brown so I am told

[Berkut]

Neil. I nearly wet myself when I read this

So did I ,when it happened, AND when I typed the post.:D

[KiteTrainer]

So did I ,when it happened, AND when I typed the post.:D


Glad his pals could not see it , it would not have looked too cool:lol:

[Fraser Hamilton]

I like to compare8-)

nise going you must feal so prowed and on top of the worald and thats just about your land :lol: evray time i get a bird or dog enterd just feals sutch an acheavement and all your blood swet and tears have ben more than worth while and nouthing can bring ya down :supz:


atb
fraser

[Berkut]

nise going you must feal so prowed and on top of the worald and thats just about your land :lol: evray time i get a bird or dog enterd just feals sutch an acheavement and all your blood swet and tears have ben more than worth while and nouthing can bring ya down :supz:


atb
fraser

Spot on Fraser.Thanks very much.

ATB,
Neil

[Sarah J]

An excellent turn of events as usual Mr Hunter :heart: :heart:

(1 down, 3 to go :yawinkle:)

Love the pics, really pleased that you had such an excellent day together - please keep up the good posts 8-)

[TimDog80]

He got a fright.I couldn't do anything for laughing.He wasn't pleased at first but he saw the funny side later, once he had cleaned the puncture marks on his legs and changed his boxers.:twisted::lol:
cruel git!!!:lol:.........i bet you never forewarned him it may happen neither!!:lol:

[CoyoteOutlaw]

As always, brilliant Neil!!! Spike is finding his groove I see :) Keep us posted!

[Berkut]

cruel git!!!:lol:.........i bet you never forewarned him it may happen neither!!:lol:

I was expecting Spike to have a grab at me.I guess he musn't have liked my after shave.:P

[TimDog80]

I was expecting Spike to have a grab at me.I guess he musn't have liked my after shave.:P
i guess so mate:lol:

whats the plan from here on regarding single kills and then the switching to multiples??

regards
tim

p.s glad to see this great thread back on track:supz:

[Berkut]

Thanks for all the comments. I have to say today was a great day,especially after all the doubts I had. I suppose the main difference is he will be flying about a pound heavier than if he had been parent reared ,which will add to his drive and energy.
If I had to choose between parent-reared and imprint eagle as a hunting partner, I would go for parent-reared every day of the week.Although this has been a very rewarding experience, I am fortunate it seems to have worked out for me.

I will keep you posted as I should be out hunting at least 3 days a week from now till the end of March.

ATB,
Neil

[Berkut]

i guess so mate:lol:

whats the plan from here on regarding single kills and then the switching to multiples??

regards
tim

p.s glad to see this great thread back on track:supz:

Tim,
A dozen singles,by which time Bentley and Cinnibar will be in for breeding and then I 'll move on to multiples as I put the remainder of the season into Spike.

Neil

[Fraser Hamilton]

I like to compare8-)

Thanks for all the comments. I have to say today was a great day,especially after all the doubts I had. I suppose the main difference is he will be flying about a pound heavier than if he had been parent reared ,which will add to his drive and energy.
If I had to choose between parent-reared and imprint eagle as a hunting partner, I would go for parent-reared every day of the week.Although this has been a very rewarding experience, I am fortunate it seems to have worked out for me.

I will keep you posted as I should be out hunting at least 3 days a week from now till the end of March.

ATB,
Neil
that seounds like a good and fun filled plan :supz:
intresting you sed a pr is a better compainon for hunting than an inprint
is it just hare you intend to fly him at or are you goint to try outher quorrie e.g fox deer rabbit or mibby goose?


atb

fraser

[JoHo]

Excellent Neil, After all the effort you put in no lesser reward would have been satisfying. You must be like a kid that just found the on button on a new toy.

Enjoy mate, you deserve it.

Johann

[Matthew Patching]

Very nice neil, you deserve it, after all the ***** that you have had to put up with both on and off the forum!:lol:

[Elly]

Excellent news. Its been a torrid day today, nice to come home and have something gratifying like that to read. Well done Neil, sure it'll be the first of many for the not-so-little lad. :supz:

[Berkutchi]

Spike's First Hare

Woo-hoo!!

Been waiting for this! Lovely - I can just picture the boy closing the gap, throwing out those feet, and plowing into a fleeing blue. Reminds me of Elsa finally connecting the dots and colliding with her first hare.

Seems like he was just a clumsy, tettering fuzzball not long ago at all.

Great pictures (ahem...aside from that unusually ugly, smelly old mutt back there that is :-P)

Looking forward to descending upon the Hunter bros. again this year. Who knows, I might even make tea! (well, I suppose I shouldn't get ahead of myself now - we'll see)

--Lauren

[Falconry Equipment International]

glad to see spike dooing well Neil, I will take time to read this thread when the wether gets bad:yawinkle:

[Rex06]

Tim,
A dozen singles,by which time Bentley and Cinnibar will be in for breeding and then I 'll move on to multiples as I put the remainder of the season into Spike.

Neil

aren't you forgetting someone ? .... the impaler:lol:
neil i wish u alot of luck with eagles and al the rest of the family m8

greetzz

[Palmer]

Spot on mate, i havn't really been very active on here, but this is brilliant :D

I still have the picture on my phone that you sent me the first day you picked him up!!

Nice 1 Ed

[Elly]

Who knows, I might even make tea! (well, I suppose I shouldn't get ahead of myself now - we'll see)




Im planning to usurp you as tea maker Im afraid. Stick to what you know, gate opener :lol:

[Berkutchi]

Im planning to usurp you as tea maker Im afraid. Stick to what you know, gate opener :lol:

Ah - fair dos. Stick to what you know then, eh? It pains me to say, I was never cut out the for the job to begin with. :lol: Although, I hasten to add, I wasn't the only one to have difficulty...have you heard about the soapy Bovril incident? ;)

[KiteTrainer]

Ah - fair dos. Stick to what you know then, eh? It pains me to say, I was never cut out the for the job to begin with. :lol: Although, I hasten to add, I wasn't the only one to have difficulty...have you heard about the soapy Bovril incident? ;)

You are allowed one mistake:roll:

[Elly]

Ah - fair dos. Stick to what you know then, eh? It pains me to say, I was never cut out the for the job to begin with. :lol: Although, I hasten to add, I wasn't the only one to have difficulty...have you heard about the soapy Bovril incident? ;)

No, do enlighten me!

[Berkut]

Out today in terrible weather conditions. Decided to give Spike another day on his own today, so rope work was done first thing with the other eagles to take temptation away.
Spike weighed in at 8lb 7.5 oz. John and I were on the moor for 1pm. Spike was quite vocal today which really cheesed me off.This has just started since his first kill last week. It is only intermittent ,so for the time being is bearable. The wind was strong and the hail was hitting us hard in the face.

After a couple of minutes a hare burst. Spike chased it without hesitation,but the wind seemed too strong for him. He persevered for as long as he could before landing in the heather.
Not long after that , Bisto came on point. I approached from behind and with about 25 yards to go the hare burst. Spike was on it in no time and took it well in difficult conditions. It was far from a good flight ,but was a good confidence builder and a bonus to take a hare at all in the weather we had.
After he calmed down on the kill I was able to open it up bare handed and he was a treat to handle as he had a decent warm meal.

KT will post some photos.

ATB,
Neil

[TinvinPeregrine]

well done neil:supz:

[KiteTrainer]

Here are some of the pictures from today

http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/dd54/Kitetrainer/Spike22nov010.jpg

http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/dd54/Kitetrainer/Spike22nov009.jpg

http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/dd54/Kitetrainer/Spike22nov008.jpg

[TimDog80]

superb stuff mate:D, his manners on the kill look superb you must be well happy with that:goodman::supz:.........shame about the weather though:-x


ATB
tim

[Gary F]

looking and sounding good,

[RedNoseK9]

Brilliant neil shame about the vocals but hopefully that will pull straight soon enough

Wez

[Berkut]

Brilliant neil shame about the vocals but hopefully that will pull straight soon enough

Wez

Cheers Wez, as I say it is not constant, so hopefully it will reduce the more he kills.

ATB,
Neil

[Laggan]

I don't use icons very much, and don't understand many of them, but if this means I am envious then it's the right one to use! :mrgreen:

[Northwest_Guy]

Wow! that is a really nice bird I goota say and to see the pic with you bare handed at the quarry!!! OMG

Looks like a real quality bird mate nice one :supz:

[Berkut]

I don't use icons very much, and don't understand many of them, but if this means I am envious then it's the right one to use! :mrgreen:

:lol:

Wow! that is a really nice bird I goota say and to see the pic with you bare handed at the quarry!!! OMG

Looks like a real quality bird mate nice one :supz:

Thankyou.

[Alan G]

Great to hear how the two of you are coming along, another feather in the cap for th eboth of you and KT seems to be getting a dab hand at this technical stuff now (Pics). :rolleyes::yawinkle:

[KiteTrainer]

Great to hear how the two of you are coming along, another feather in the cap for th eboth of you and KT seems to be getting a dab hand at this technical stuff now (Pics). :rolleyes::yawinkle:

I am a slow starter but once I get going:rolleyes:

[Falconry Equipment International]

Brilliant thread Neil :yawinkle::goodman:

[Berkut]

Spike continues to progress well. He has been handled and worked on by Roy Lupton for the last week.He is now off down to Kent for the next few weeks so Roy can do a lot more work with him.He sees a lot of potential in him and I will update the thread at a later date.

ATB,
Neil

[Gary F]

just read,eagle season,cinnibar, and now spike thread,,, seems like you had a awsum fortnite hunting, cinnibar done well:D,fingers crossed now for her and bentley,,
spikes in kent with roy? nice place kent ,pity musketmad <nigel> lives there lol,,
david fox never come up then??:rolleyes:
atb
gary

[MusketMad]

Well neil here he is ...im gonna be doing a lot of work with him in the next couple of weeks with a view to getting up there with him fairly soon ...he was out today on the lure but is still not flying that hard ...its funny as he still acts like a proper baby and is quite a character...gonna start working him hard now ....The good thing about getting out with sir roger :prayer:is that he does push them hard and gets out every single day ....hes on the phone every day at twelve o clock saying "come on where are you,im ready"
hes a stunner mate"who bred him"????:lol:

[Berkut]

He's looking good Nigel. Keep up the good work with Spike and Roger.:prayer:

[luke brouwer]

hey.
what a information i can only learn of this.Thanks:supz:
sorry about my englisch:oops:
greets luke.

[RedNoseK9]

Well out today with Spike as he is residing at mine until the GOE and Jason (sparstheone) offered me a day out at some Brownies Gaz also came along but was gutted to discover we ment hares not girl guides.
I arrived at Jas house for around 12 and we had a coffee whilst waiting for Gaz and then went out and flew Rio who had a couple of lovely flights on hare herself but today was not her day and we ended empty handed.

3 pm we arrived at the land where we were flying spike and it looked the perfect setting for some hare flights so we got him ready and headed off,
As we entred the first field we decided to walk along the hedgerow and see if we could push anything into the middle of the field.
After 5 mins jason called hare and sure enough a brownie got up about 600 yards out so i slipped the hood and spike fluffed around a little before spotting the hare and flying it hard by now the hare was about 800 yards from us and decided to stop but Spike was covering ground fast and as he approached the hare he was about 3 feet away when it burst into life again and was off leaving Spike to look a complete fool with a foot full of earth.
I made my way towards him for a recall and he came when i got about 200 yards out and was just tuckin into his ration when a second hare got up about 300 yards out but unfortunately Spike wanted his reward and did not fly it.
No sooner had i got the hood on and taken 2 steps than a 3rd hare broke this time 300 yards to my left so i slipped Spikes hood and he left the fist immediately the hare put his ears down and was gone but spike followed in hot persuit and worked really well but these hares can move and after a about another 150 yards the hare had made good its escape and Spike pulled up shouting at it so i recalled again and off we set.
The next flight didnt come for about 20 mins but it was a short flight of about 400 yards in total but the hare put into the wind and accelerated downhill Spike flew it but to no avail and he turned in the air and returned the glove instantly.
Spikes final flight of the day was a hare that ran uphill just infron so i unhooded him and he powered away but so di the hare and Spike pulled off to right which was concerning but he immediately started to pump hard so i ran after him and saw that his attention had been turned to pair of fox that had obviously been coursing the hare he flew hard but the wind seemed to get the better of him and he was out classed by 2 crafty fox he returned to the glove and we called it a day before feeding him up .
Overall the day was a success for Spike as allowed him to focus on things a bit more and helped with fitness however manners could be improved as the beginning of the days was impeccable but towards the end he began to show signs of bad manners.
A great day out Thanx Jason mate and Gaz for your company perfect warm up for next week and i look forward to flying with you both very soon.
A pleasure working with him aswell Neil thankyou

Wez

[Laggan]

Hi Wez,

would you elucidate/expand a little on the "bad manners" comment as the day progressed and how this manifested itself? Was this frustration in your opinion? Thanks.

Iain

[OutFlying]

Good outing Wes,
The 1000 yard flight sounds a cracker, did he manage to turn the hare ? if so how many times ?

Watching Joe's gos fly the hares is always a good viewing. An eagle must be some sight.

Jim.

[RedNoseK9]

Sorry jim that flight was about 500 yards in total mate and that was ment to read 150 yards it was a typo :oops:

[RedNoseK9]

As Spike had not been flown on quarry for the past few weeks or so and had been flown on the lure where he was rewarded after catching the lure every time i would say that the frustration of the days hard flying just left him a little bad tempered and he mantled more than i like and was a little sticky on the glove there were no worrying signs of aggression just stupidity really.

Wez



Hi Wez,

would you elucidate/expand a little on the "bad manners" comment as the day progressed and how this manifested itself? Was this frustration in your opinion? Thanks.

Iain

[OutFlying]

Sorry jim that flight was about 500 yards in total mate and that was ment to read 150 yards it was a typo :oops:

Still not bad Wes,
Did he throw a bend into it or was it a straight flight ?

Jim.

[RedNoseK9]

Still not bad Wes,
Did he throw a bend into it or was it a straight flight ?

Jim.


The hare ran straight line and Spike flew it well he had to negotiate a fence which he did as though it was not there and jinked over then a slight turn right and powered toward the hare but as he made in the hare jinked and spike turned but all was lost Possibly due to the previous flight.


wez

[OutFlying]

The hare ran straight line and Spike flew it well he had to negotiate a fence which he did as though it was not there and jinked over then a slight turn right and powered toward the hare but as he made in the hare jinked and spike turned but all was lost Possibly due to the previous flight.


wez

Now that is a good flight description, thanks Wes.

Jim.

[Berkut]

I have been hunting Spike in difficult winds off the fist this week.He has caught a couple of hares and been very unlucky on a few more.

Today I had him waiting on in a stiff breeze for over half an hour.He handled the wind very well. He did take a hare at one point, but only with one foot and he lost it.

Better luck tomorrow.

Neil.

[MusketMad]

I have been hunting Spike in difficult winds off the fist this week.He has caught a couple of hares and been very unlucky on a few more.

Today I had him waiting on in a stiff breeze for over half an hour.He handled the wind very well. He did take a hare at one point, but only with one foot and he lost it.

Better luck tomorrow.

Neil.waiting on now mate ...

[RedNoseK9]

He is going from strength to strength now mate just the weather holding him back slightly

Wez

[MusketMad]

He is going from strength to strength now mate just the weather holding him back slightly

Wezwasnt i going to bed an hour ago wes:lol:

[RedNoseK9]

Addicted

[JoHo]

Addicted
How many times in 10 min do you have to click "unread posts" to realise that its bed time..... we need to ask Paul to make some changes to the code. If you click unread posts more than 20 times in ten min, it need to popup a message "GO TO BED DAMMIT THERE IS NO MORE NEW POSTS"

[Talon]

great reading.

[SakerHunter]

what a great thread keep up the good work

[Gary F]

what a great thread keep up the good work
not much hope of that mate,
berkut is no longer a member, have to agree was a great thread

[Phil Noble]

Any update on spike Neil?
ATB
Phil

[Berkut]

Any update on spike Neil?
ATB
Phil


Very vocal.He was sold some time ago.

Neil.

[Phil Noble]

Very vocal.He was sold some time ago.

Neil.

Silly me:rolleyes:
Phil

[CJTaylor]

Good to see you back active on here Neil , look forward to your posts.....colin