Licencing for all B.O.P?

[North East Harris Hawker]

Its been requested so here it is.
Do you think that all birds of prey in the uk should be licenced?
state your opinion with the why's and how's
lee

[Wightwings]

http://www.falconryforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=570

thought we'd done this one

[Sparrow Hawker]

Thanks North East,

Any chance you could put it up on Global Anouncement?

All The Best,

Regards,

HH

[Wightwings]

well to repeat all previuos threads, yes they should but who? what ? when ? why?
sorry to be a bit padantic but surely we've battered this one to death? :roll:

[Bill]

I need to see full details of your proposed scheme before I would commit one way or the other. I suspect when you sit down and work out the details it might not seem so attractive.

At the end of the day the RSPCA can take action now within existing laws if birds are kept in cruel conditions. I know there is a an area between good and cruel conditions where we would like to see improvement but once licenced keepers standards will drop. Whats your driving like now you've passed your test?

Oh god tell me to lighten up - I'm making myself depressed :x :(

[Wightwings]

all valid points though Bill. it is very easy to say lets licence everything, but there needs to be the correct control or we are all destined for the undergrowth.

[North East Harris Hawker]

im only doing what has been requested, theres a lot of folks out there with stolen birds, folks who shouldnt have birds and those who exploit falconry by breeding in squalid conditions, if stricter guidlines were implemented, everyone would be eligible to be visited by a pwlo and have their set up inspected say, every 6 months? surely this would be better for falconer and bird? i think if this took off and breeders were forced by law to have all offspring microchipped it would cut bird theft down to minute levels
now, your comments please!

[Ian Wileman]

Depends on the pricing structure of the licence. For example, is someone paying 40 quid to buy a barn owl (in loot couple of weeks ago), going to then pay 50 quid for a licence? whereas, someone who paid 5000 quid for a golden eagle, would think 20 quid for a licence was nothing. May send a lot of breeders, owners, etc underground!!

[Wightwings]

true, you need a dog licence ( i think you still do???) who actually comes and checks on your dog? lyou need a tele licence do they care about the condition! the word licence means tax, money to other people. regulation as discussed elsehwere yes, docs for ALL types of BoP as with pere's yes.licences no for me

[North East Harris Hawker]

http://www.falconryforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=570

thought we'd done this one
No that thread was just on harrises and red tails, im on about all BOP species

[North East Harris Hawker]

true, you need a dog licence ( i think you still do???) who actually comes and checks on your dog? lyou need a tele licence do they care about the condition! the word licence means tax, money to other people. regulation as discussed elsehwere yes, docs for ALL types of BoP as with pere's yes.licences no for me
apologies for the double post but i see what your getting at with this comment.
we all pay enough tax/licences are you suggesting some kind of registration law rather than licencing?

ie. "All BOP regardless of species are to be identichipped and IBR rung. Any person who is in posesssion of any BOP must have proper documentation for the bird and proof of ownership. The keeper must register these details with the nearest PWLO and allow access for regular inspections of his/her documentation and premises"

This would cost pennies (identichip, IBR and a few pieces of paper) and would cut down on theft and reduce the number of those who keep their birds in cramped/less than clean conditions.

[Wightwings]

brilliant you read my tiny mind there NEHH. stick that in a party manifesto and i would vote for you as PM.
that statement says it all in my mind. :mrgreen:

[North East Harris Hawker]

thanks WW, but what does everyone else think?
no doubt some one will pick holes in it :roll:
lets hear it then!!!


"at your target in front, in your own time, go on"

[Wightwings]

"clear"

[Debbie]

[quote="North East Harris Hawker

ie. "All BOP regardless of species are to be identichipped and IBR rung. Any person who is in posesssion of any BOP must have proper documentation for the bird and proof of ownership. The keeper must register these details with the nearest PWLO and allow access for regular inspections of his/her documentation and premises"

This would cost pennies (identichip, IBR and a few pieces of paper) and would cut down on theft and reduce the number of those who keep their birds in cramped/less than clean conditions.[/quote]

Not sure what PWLO is but the police branch of wild animals would do for me.

I agree wich this 100%

also any decent owner would get their animal tagged by some sorts either by ringing (IBR) on the foot at birth or/and micro chipping.

Also common sense tells you to photograph your animal each year and keep a details folder just incase they get pinched.

I have photos of all my cats and my parrakeet - oh yes and my jewelery not that its worth loads but the two chokers I have cost me £25 each and were hand made and 100% unique and although not real I just adore them :wink:

Debbs

[North East Harris Hawker]

PWLO = police wildlife liason officer. there is normally one at most main police stations

[Debbie]

PWLO = police wildlife liason officer. there is normally one at most main police stations

Yep we have one and it was him and 3 off his colleagues which this spring were knee deep in mud helping a deer who I had spotted on the way home from work which was stuck in a ditch, I also dragged a very non pleased vet out aswell :lol:

[Bones]

Sorry but there is a simpler answer just do what they do in the far east and other third world countrys and chop there hands off when they get caught WHAT A DETERENT :evil:

[North East Harris Hawker]

i suppose you could callthat a kind of "tax rebate" debbie, i'd have loved to have seen that!

with regards to bones's comment, im completely with you, its a shame the tax fiddling morons in parliment are the ones who make the laws up!
zero tollerance rocks!

[Ian Wileman]

I.B.R. rung, Identichipped, AND a blood feather held somehow (for DNA). Oh ye, and I still say the pitbull would help. lol.

[Mr. Fong]

Yo folks, I just received the state falconry laws from NJ (I might be going back there) and I will tell you they are sticklers for controls! !. you have to have your facilities inspected BEFORE you can get a bird and you have to comply with all sorts of other regulations as well. The bird is considered property of the State, (even though you may have bought it from a breeder!) and when it dies, the body must be turned in to the State. If you lose, transfer or sell a bird you need to notify the state in writing. Talk about controls!! Well I'm going back in July 05 and I'll have to obey.

Sorry I get kind of long-winded about that stuff
[/b]

[North East Harris Hawker]

well, if you ask me they have the right idea, we could do with taking a leaf out of their book, i bet they dont have half as many problems in new jersey

[Ian Wileman]

JUST HAD EXTRA TWINSPOT LIGHT FITTED. With a bit of luck I will sleep tonight. Going out with the mustalids in the morning!

[Jiff]

for a long time i thaught that flying a bird of prey was a very scrutinised hobby i was very supprised how easy it was to aquire a bird of prey,i only mention aquire,because thats the only part thats easy,keeping them hunting them,breeding ect certainly i'snt which is why i cast a vote of yes to liecencing,regardless of cost,if you had to be more answerable for you'r acctions then there would be a lot less pressure on rehab and rescue centers from miss used birds,if you had to sit some sort of apprentiship i'm sure the well meaning,caught up in the romance type people would fall by the wayside well before buying and then selling a bird.

[North East Harris Hawker]

good points there jiff, there are too many people who get a "bee in their bonnet" after seeing a demo who rush out and buy birds. Harrises have bred well in captivity and their prices have fallen somewhat making them affordable to most people, such a shame that breeders let them go without asking questions

[Wightwings]

I agree Jiff about the apprentiship/capability side, but don't get that confused with the word licence. If the licence was like the driving test and you had to demonstrate your skills first it may be a viable option. but if the licence was like the dog/fishing/even tv licence there would be no point.

[Ian Wileman]

If you are going down this road, be careful....I dont think there are many drivers out there who would realistically pass their driving test if they had to take it again! Scary? Not as scary as the R.S.P.C.A officer who rang my friend saying they had found a harris hawk he had lost (creance snapped during garden training last thursday). He went 20 miles to pick up his bird....very pleased....until he got there and the R.S.P.C.A presented him with a little female kestrel!!!!!! OH ****!

[North East Harris Hawker]

PERHAPS its the rspca officers who need licences in species identification! :lol:

[Wightwings]

RSPCA, now there is an organisation you DO NOT want involved in any licencing issue. brewery and drinking party come to mind.

[Ian Wileman]

I wouldnt invite one to a party. I think every one I have ever come across was mildy cretinous. Not that I wouldnt invite a cretin to a party, but one that would come here, look in at the birds and ask how old the mallards were, would be just too much. Thick...strawberry smoothy!

[Wightwings]

Lmao :lol: :lol: I stopped myself writing that could i can guarentee there will be members on here that are associated. I completely agree though bloody hopeless the lot of em.

[North East Harris Hawker]

who thinks a registration scheme is the way ahead then?

[Sean White]

Question?......How many British falconers fly a hawk into its 3rd or 4th season ? . Not many I think. Hawks have become like the latest bit of fishing takle-use it till something better comes along. Sorry to bore all with this thread but "YES" I think we should be licenced. Lets be honest here...there are far more birds being bred than are being sold and I cant help but wonder but whats happening to all the male stock being bred, breeders need to be policed also! Lets cut out the time wasters/posers who fly a hawk because its something different and lets get some sort of licence system .
Sean,Shrops.(hawk 12 and dog 6).

[Gaz]

Top post :!:

[Bill]

If this works you will have a word document attached. It is the response of the Hawkboard to Article 10 registrations.

If it doesn't show I can email a copy to anyone who would like a copy (8 pages) but it does show the how complex an issue registration is. PM if you need it

Edited - I see how it works - option to download on right.

[Bill]

This one is on the likely costs

[North East Harris Hawker]

good posts bill, wel :) l done

[Bill]

good posts bill, wel :) l done

No problem. It shows how much work the hawk board are havving to do. I have another one or their response to changes inthe general licence but maybe that should be on another thread - Legal Issues?