Peregrines

[Peregrynne]

Since Barbarys and Aplomados and Red Napes are all types of Peregrines, would they all have the same easy manning tendancies?

Are there differences in performance and flying style?

Would it make sense to cross breed them with other longwings like Sakers or Gyrs or Lanners?

[Athene]

No, no, no aplomados are NOT peregrines. They are smaller, less dense, have a longer tail, they are like a sparrowhawk body with a falcon head. They are also smarter than peregrines. Too clever I guess.

It makes no sense to teach an aplomado to wait on, since its stoop is not as fast as a peregrine's but on the other hand its maneuverability and speed allows for amusing flights at lapwings, pipits etc. They are very reliable with quail, too.

[Peregrynne]

Sorry my lack of knowledge stems from my lack of contact with both the birds and the people who fly them. Yet my question still stands.

What would the outcome be from cross breeding different sub-species of peregrine with other falcons?

Do they all share the same general temperment are the larger birds the only ones that seem to be easier to man?

[Shaun Byrne]

I wouldn't consider the Pere to be easy to man. In fact they can be bad tempered and as stroppy as any other longwing. The Shaheen and Barbary are already widely used as hybrid crosses, more for their power and tenacity rather than any manning issues.

[Varmint]

Barbaries and Red Napes make "Natural" mounting game hawks due to their smaller size, meaning they have to hit hard in a stoop rather than tail chase and bind.

It is for these qualitities that they are hybridized, not for temperament or aggresion.

I have flown all manner of Hybrid, but have now reverted back to pure , natural falcons.

Some hybrids are renown for their bad or good disposition, but are inconsistent in performance on the whole (with the poss exception of Intermewed Gyr/Peri and Peri/Sakers)

For what its worth, you folks over in the USA have a very recent hybrid in the form of the decendants of birds released by the Peregrine fund in the 80's as pure anatum peregrines were bred with all manner of sub species for release back into the wild, so you tell us what your peregrine hybrids are like? :wink:

[Bird_Dog]

Varmit --

It is commonly said that anatums are less aggressive than peales peregrine. I flew a imprinted female St Charlett/Aleutian peales out of Gieger's breeding project a few years ago that was extremely aggressive toward me and game. She had superior performance in high wind. Perhaps the extreme conditions in Alaska and hunting in coastal environments created a more aggressive subspecies. A nearby falconer friend has a pair of "true" anatums in his breeding projects. It seems that anatums are desired for their appearance... i.e., full black caps. I wouldn't knock their hunting ability, tho. His hen is the largest peregrine I've seen 40 0z. and the offspring have done very well in duck hawking. Some of the critisms about peregrines having fragile egos and being dumb, for me, are hard to link to a particular subspecies. My guess is that most US falconers flew hybrid with predominately pealei lineages.

The bird I currenly fly is a 13/15 peales from old taggert bloodlines. As with many of the hybrid peales/anatums its hard to assess just what innate behavioral difference exist. Size and appearance rather than soley behavior are how many falconers choose a bird to buy. In my experience a full-capped 3/4 peales tiercel would refuse to chase mallards under any circumstances while my 13/15 peales tiercel seems to prefer mallards when attacking a mixed flock of ducks. Otside of that there's not much difference, behaviorally.

We're waiting to gain access to passage tundra peregrines and be able to trap a 'beach bird'. The old timers have a lot of good things to say about them if you can keep from losing them. I've seen one Scottish peregrine in Texas... it was large and well-manned. It would have been a great grouse hawk, but unfortunately it chased a prairie chicken into the woods. And was found dead at the base of a tree next to a dead prairie chicken.

-- Bird_dog

[Varmint]

Bird Dog

I would really like to try the Tundra as i hear great things about them too!

I once bought an eyass female English Peregrine because of her very pale Plummage and Tundra looks (but not size)

She started out well, but became an obsessive carrier!

The Scottish Peregrines are really nice and i have 4 pairs, but to date! not bred from them (lots of eggs but all 4 pairs are still quite young)

I am starting to drift over to the simple philosophy, of best bird for the job must have evolved naturally, both specifically to the quarry and to the weather and terrain.

[Gaz]

to the simple philosophy, of best bird for the job must have evolved naturally
AMEN TO THAT :!: :supz:

[Varmint]

But i might like to add that Hybrids do have a place in Falconry, especially as beginners birds!

Many species of Peregrine are just too aggressive when it comes to game and can be easily lost! where as some hybrids need lots of encouragement in this department and can be far more forgiving in the hands of a beginner?

I think the thing that most people forget about Falcons is the fact that you must be able to serve them on a daily basis? in the UK for 90% of the population, thats impossible?