Rip off or what.

[Finnish]

Rang the local vets today where my dog has been since she was a puppy,to see how much it would be for a hip score and eye test they said they would want £412.00 +vat.I felt like saying are you on drugs.So i put the phone down after a few words and i told the vet what i thought of his surgery.Then i ring Dick Best veterinary and the vet there tel,s me £115.00 pound,s.So is it just me or was some one taking the p:@s.How can anyone justified that sort of money.

[Debbie]

I guess they can charge what ever they want to - but surley maybe trading standards or something could do something for excessive charges.

No wonder animals suffer when there are scum like this practice who way over charge how many owners have thought I can't afford that and given up and not rung for a second quote.

Debbs

[BlackHawke]

i dunno if there are any organisations overseeing the veterinary profession. if there isn't there should be.

my mum n dad have got a 15year old border collie. its been going down hill gradually over tha last few months. basically old age, arthritis in her back legs. she doesn't do anything all day apart from lay outside. dad took her to the vets a few weeks ago, basically to have her put down coz she had no quality of life. my dad came back with some anti inflamatorys some anti biotics n some medication to take the fluid away from the dogs stomach coz so the vet said the fluid was the main problem. charged him over £50 told him to come back in a week the dog was no better in a week n he was given more medication and charged him even more

nothing made any difference to the dog my dad took the dog of all the medication n if anything shes a bit better. but she still has no quality of life. shes too old. and it would be kinder to have her put down. but it appears to me that all the vet wants is money. no reason has been given for the fluid. my dad knows its kinder to put the dog down but needed the vet to support this decision not charge him a fortune for nothing

[KevGem1]

totally agree with what you are saying my mother had exactly the same situation last year, and after a lot of upset, time,and(money) she still had to have the dog put to sleep. there should be some kind of governing body to regulate what these people can charge you. I feel genuienly sorry for your dad they are just taking advantage of a very traumatic time. ill get of my soap box know. all the best and good luck KEV.

[Superfly]

I guess I'm lucky, our vet is excellent, more than once, for a check over or some small matter, they haven't charged us. Even when they do, it's reasonable. Mind you, we also have our dog insured which hsa saved us quite a bit in the past.
Even so, we've been with our vets now for around 20 years, they know us, our dogs and are great at recalling problems they have had in the past.
I guess it's like a lot of things, luck of the draw.
I was particularly grateful for the way they handled our last dogs death and the whole process, gave us a couple of weeks before they even talked about the bill for his injections and cremation. Based on stories of other vets hereabouts, have to admit, they seem a rarity.

[Sprout]

Vets are regulated by the Royal College so are accountable. I agree with your situation, if you think quality of life is suffering then your vet should respect that decision. All a vet can do is offer their opinion and possible solutions, yes anti-inflammatories will help will arthritis but that would not account for fluid in the abdomen. Fluid could result from any number of problems and further testing might find a solution that may/may not be treatable but again at the end of the day quality of life is the utmost importance and unfortunately that is a decision only the owner can make. You are always free to seek a second opinion elsewhere but if you request euthanasia on grounds of suffering then that is a fair decision and should be respected.

[Hawkmaster]

Lee was that for both scores?

[Gary Timbrell]

I know a vet on the continent who financed his early days by breeding hamsters. They die at about two years and usually get huge growths on them. If a cankerous hamster was brough it he said: "Leave it with me for two weeks". The customer returned to find a perfect hamster and a bill for 50 quid. Hamsters only cost about £3 then. There are hamsters in Belgium now that are 27 years old.

[BlackHawke]

forgot to say a vet said sometime ago that she had tumors. in the stomach area but coz of her age she porbably wouldnt come thru the operation. the vet thats been dealing with the dog now said theres nothing on her records to say that. but my dad destinctly remembers a vet saying that

[Debbie]

Rob,

What about the vet we took Peebles too as he was very good? And his rates were reasonable as well.

Maybe give the vet a ring and ask why he will not Euthanase this animal and about his money grabbing nature as Sprout said and I was hoping he would see this topic and comment with regards to the Royal College.

Say you are unhappy about the treatment given and that you will refer the matter to the Royal College with regard to prolonging patient suffering and fraudulant fee accrual - obviously this vet preys on peoples suffering and fear of losing their beloved family member with the offer of hope but at the animals expense. This is not a threat as proper practice would thus not result in any untoward questioning or upset feeling.

At the end of the day as Petra who is my vet for my bird said to me only I as the owner will know if the quality of life is there or not and when its not then I will know :cry:

I wish your parents well in this hard time.

Debbs

[Coedhirion]

I got quoted £170 to vasectamise a hob ferret the other day, told them I wanted it snipped, not gold plated...they put the phone down on me ! :cry: :cry:

[BlackHawke]

debbie thats my vets. take the dog n the bird there. its a great vets. i think i may go with my dad next time he goes n insist that the dog is put down!

[Claire]

it cost us over £80 to castrate a ferret i would guess a vasectomy is more generally

[Coedhirion]

mmm.. they reconed it was the risk of givin a small animal an anesthetic, offered em a couple 2 practice on 1st :wink: good job good avian vets dont feel the same or none of the birds they treated would stand a chance !! don't know what they teach em in vet school now a days?? spose the prices are so high now cos people either have insurance or get it for free cos they are on income support...tough on us farmers, cant get it for free cos they say we can sell a field or summit!! .. how about this.. quote today for a friend to have an opp. on a dogs hip £2,000 + consultations an after care!!!!

[Mary Quite Contrary]

you never see a poor vet.

Trading standards are starting to look at the veterinary profession a lot more now due to the massive differences between prices for the same treatment.

[Finnish]

Lee was that for both scores?

Just the hip score mate.

[Falconry Equipment International]

One thing I have noticed( I use different vets for diferent animals) is that in the last 10 years fees have gone up exponensially along with the surge in growth of animal/ vet insurance. perhaps I am an old cynic but do you think there may be some correlation between the two with vets only too keen to pick up the scalpel( finnish it would be like you deciding someone needs a new heating system because their radiator leaks ~ which I am sure you would not do) just seems strange to me ?
all the best J

[Barn Owl]

My vet charged me £58 two years ago to have my dog put to sleep, RIPOFF

[Falconry Equipment International]

Bob very sad, & they know they have us by th short & C@*lys If I had a harder heart my old Gsp that swings from looking like a pup to hardly being able to stand I would take her out pigeon shooting which she loves retreiving for me & give her abarrel when she's not expecting it.thats what I want to do ( not because I am too tight to have her put down, but she loves this, hates vets and seems to me the ultimate insult to take somewhere she dislikes tro breath her last breath after 13 yrs stal;wart service & love) unfotunately I dont know if I have the bottle. I am surethis post will be contentious and is politically uncorrect, I just don;t want my loved one to suffer more than she need without being fleeced byt the vets
J

[Sprout]

Fees are a contentious issue but remember there is no NHS for pets. Some of the fees seem excessive to me so if you don't like the sound of what you are quoted then try some where else. Can't remember how much we charge for ferret vasectomies but it's a fair bit cheaper than reported on here. As for not seeing a poor vet??? When I first qualified when you worked out the hours I worked with on call and everything I was actually paid less than minimum wage, not much better now!! Go to a doctors conference and the car park will be full of porsches, BMW's etc, the last vet conference I went to had a few old 4X4's and general run about cars. We are spolit with the NHS in this country, we charge approx £100 for a bitch spay, the same op in a human costs over £3000 to the tax payer!

[Debbie]

debbie thats my vets. take the dog n the bird there. its a great vets. i think i may go with my dad next time he goes n insist that the dog is put down!

I had a feeling you might say that :roll: :lol:

Good idea to go with your Dad like they used to come with us to give us support as kids now its out turn :)

Debbs

[BlackHawke]

sprout all the veterinary fees should be brought in line with each other. i'm not putting any vet down (pardon the pun!!) coz i know most of them do a great job. but like another message on this post said u have us by the short n curlies! we had a 7 year old german shepherd went in coz its stomach was bloated turnes out there were tumors on his spleen. i think! he came through the operation. vet told us there werequite a few tumors when they opened him up. our dog died in recovery. not only did we have to come to terms with the loss of our dog we had to fork out £430 with nothing to show at the end of it

[The Late Lord Lucan]

Blackhawke wrote..all the veterinary fees should be brought in line with each other

That's just not going to happen is it?
When one vet has all the specialist equipment and expertise to deal with specialist areas such as raptors, and the other deals with bunnies cats & dogs.
How do you think all the equipment & training for specialist patients gets paid for?
There is just one reason they can't all be the same.

Now, if you want to provide the money to train ALL the vets, and supply ALL the surgeries with equal equipment & knowledge............

My motto here is........if you don't like something about the service you are getting, go get it elsewhere.........

Regards,
LLL.

[BlackHawke]

i'm talkin about dogs not raptors. theres no reason the cost of treatment shouldnt be brought in line for basic treatment.xrays, blood tests theres a huge difference in price of medication or just the consultation fees. and some people dont have the luxury of havin more than 1 vet in there locality, so for them freedom of choice n shoppin around is difficult.

just a little example look how much vets charge for worming tablets for my dog just under £20 u can buy them in the supermarket for a tenner.

please please no one get me wrong about vets i've found a good one whos prices r reasonable.n he's a great bloke who does a wonderful job but for a lot of people their pets are the most important parts of their lives. some vets know this n take advantage

[Sprout]

Spend as many £10 in supermarket as you want, they don't work!! Surgeries are equipped differently, use different drugs etc so all have different overheads. Thats why I said if you're not happy with a quote go somewhere else. If looking for a plumber I'd imagine you'd phone more than one for a quote.

[The Late Lord Lucan]

just a little example look how much vets charge for worming tablets for my dog just under £20 u can buy them in the supermarket for a tenner.
I'd guess their wormers are about as good as their flea treatments.......
You'd be better off trying to squash them with your Doc Martins than spraying with Bob Martins.........
A good proportion of supermarket treatments are probably based on Old Wives Tales.......
However, Supermarkets do sell at least one product that is very useful......Olive Oil.

Regards,
Lucky.

[BlackHawke]

this was just an example. but as we this has been highlighted. if it doesn't work how come its on general sale. any drug that is put on the market is tested. for safety effectiveness etc. it may not be as effective as prescribed worming medication when treating a animal with worms. but doesn't this depend on the seriousness of the infestation. even prescribed medication would have trouble if it was serious. but for preventing rather than treating worms it is perfectly adequate. dont the tablets sold in supermarkets contain the same active compounds as the medication vets prescribe? just in smaller quantities?

another example my dads dog and my bird were both prescribed 50mg synulox in tablet form TD exactly the same quantity, exactly the same amount except the medication for the bird was over £8 cheaper n i have the receipts to prove this.

any comments about the consulation fees, xrays etc?

vets like doctors etc can make a tidy sum testing new medication on their patients for drug companies.

i love a bit of healthy banter!! :roll:

[Sprout]

If the dose is wrong it won't work, it's not a case of killing some of the worms if you use lower doses, it works or it doesn't. A lot of the supermarket brands are tested for safety but not always efficacy and most are very narrow spectrum so to cover for all types of worms likely to be picked up may require 2-3 products that would cost more than a broad spectrum, effective product from a vets/pharmacy. The ingredients are often different too. As for synulox the cost of drug should be the same whether cat dog bird or mouse, its the same drug but doses vary, dogs its 12.5mg/kg so I assume your dog is 4-5kg in weight, birds its 150mg/kg so I assume the bird weighs 10-11 ounces??

[Jack Merlin]

Don't get me started!

I pass two vets to get to my current ones who are quite good. I was at vet college but failed my exams so I know enough to know when I am being conned and I am afraid that is all too frequent. It is nice to catch them out though!

I had a dog with patches of hair loss. The vet took some skin scrapings, looked at them under the microscope and announced that it was mange and he would sell me some ointment. Without waiting for permission, I went across to the microscope and looked, saying it was a while since I had see mange mites...and I couldn't see any now! The vet went a bright shade of pink and said he thought it might be a good idea to treat for mange "just in case". I didn't go back there again!

The best bet is to post your experiences on the news groups, naming the vet involved, BUT what you say must be (a) true, and (b) provable as the truth in a court of law, i.e. independent witnesses. Write letters and keep copies, record telephone calls, and have a friend with you when you take your animal or bird to the vet.

I'm afraid the vets don't get much out of us farmers these days (it is cheaper to use a bullet) and the pet keeper is being milked. It is a disgrace that it has come to this, but veterinary surgery is no longer a profession, it is a trade the same as any other.

[OutFlying]

One thing I have noticed( I use different vets for diferent animals) is that in the last 10 years fees have gone up exponensially along with the surge in growth of animal/ vet insurance. perhaps I am an old cynic but do you think there may be some correlation between the two with vets only too keen to pick up the scalpel( finnish it would be like you deciding someone needs a new heating system because their radiator leaks ~ which I am sure you would not do) just seems strange to me ?
all the best J

How many 13 year old dogs whose back legs had failed, now using a walking frame did you see before insurance for pets evolved ? Nowadays dogs that should be put down are now soldiering on - generating huge bills. I wouldn't say that these treatments are providing quality of life but just prolonging the life.

[BlackHawke]

bird is fhh with wing infection 2lb 2 at time dog border collie not big. but both 50mg td 4 a week. infact i was prescribed the same amount twice for the bird by 2 different vets for 2 different problems. TD= three times a day so u r right sprout 150mg per kg

oh the reason see doctors in decent cars is they dont have to carry their patients in the back. or go trapsing up muddy roads to farms. they probably leave their decent cars at home for the weekend!!!! :D

sprout i agree with u saying shop around but its hard to do that when u got a dog that needs immediate treatment u cant really say to the vet hold on for 20 mins while i fone around for prices. in situations like that they really got u by the curlies!!

[Hawkmaster]

I was prescribed wormer for my dog and told the price, I decided to hang fire till next time and got the same product at a supermaket, at less than a tenth of the vet price and I still have more tabs left.

[Sprout]

150mg/kg twice daily so for a female Harris that should be 3x50mg tablets twice daily so in fact the bird was under dosed by half. Warn your vet next time

[Sprout]

Yes Hawkmaster but the worms are probably still there too. In an emergency you go where you know but I would have assumed you'd already chosen a local vets that suit you prior to the emergency ie for routine vaccinations/worming/health checks and phoning around for a price guide for these may give you an indication of the likely charges of each practice. Again it is important to do this as far as birds are concerned, don't wait until an emergency, make inquiries before you need to as most vets don't understand birds and either won't see you or treat them as they would a dog ie try this and wait and see, come back if its no better - with birds you often don't get a wait and see! Also if using cat and dog doses then drugs may be underdosed by accident!!

[BlackHawke]

thanx for the advice i hope i dont get into the situation where i have to take her to the vets for that sort of thing again

[Sprout]

Hope not. What wing infection? Bite wound, oedema, blaine?? Ask your vet to buy a copy of the BSAVA manual of Pigeons, Raptors and Waterfowl, it's the best basic book that covers most things and has the proper drug doses in for them (or buy it yourself but it's not cheap).

[BlackHawke]

he did say i forgot but not oedema or blaine just an infection where shes caught her wing when going in. shes lost 4 primaries so far.

[Sprout]

If the feathers have fallen out with dead skin attached it sounds very much like it was wing tip oedema. The feathers usually fall out 4-6 weeks after the initial insult and may not regrow again if the follicles are damaged.

[BlackHawke]

vet said definatly wasnt oedema. she wouldnt b able to fly. she'd b hanging it. shes not doing either. looking of what may cause WTO she would be extremly extremly unlucky to get it. shes free lofted, never put back wet, it wasnt that cold here b4 xmas, n shes 15 years old

[Kevin Massey]

I was prescribed wormer for my dog and told the price, I decided to hang fire till next time and got the same product at a supermaket, at less than a tenth of the vet price and I still have more tabs left.

i think neil forbes , will let you send him mute samples, test them then prescribe the correct doseage and correct stuff ( there are more that 1 type of avian worms) and return it to you and that was about £6 ish i think

kev

[Sprout]

Birds can fly perfectly well initially with WTO until the feathers fall out and they don't necessarily droop wings. My Harris was 10 and also free lofted but caught it this year. Luckily I caught it early and treated it, fortunately she didn't lose any feathers. I wouldn't rule out WTO just because of the conditions although I'd admit it would be very unlucky (same as me) but it does sound very suspicious.

[BlackHawke]

its over 4 months since i first noticed it n took her to vets. shes till flyin ok in aviary. theres no skin around the base of feather just dried bloody puss!

[Sprout]

Pleasant! :vom:

[Coedhirion]

my friend had 2 FH Hawks last winter, both kept in identicle presumed near perfect conditions with under perch heaters, never put away damp etc etc. She has kept & flown all kinds of birds of prey for many years. Luckily she spotted WTO on the younger of the two birds before any permanent damage was done, but it proves that however careful you think you have been it can still happen. A close related male HH belonging to a less experienced falconer got WTO around the same time. He happily continued flying it, he thought that there couldnt be much wrong as it was still happy to hunt!! When the feathers started to fall, he didnt notice the bits of bone attached, thought it was moulting early!!! the bird has been found a home for breeding as it will never be able to fly again as it lost the whole end to one wing. A sad end for a real nice first year bird.
Moral...you can never be too careful, find the best avian vet you can even if it requires a 4 hour drive (mine is)... it is cheaper in the long run

[Sprout]

Good advice

[Stewigan]

on the subject of vets, i bought a choc lab in october last yr, he cost me £500 a lovely dog too, he started to limp so we had him to the vets and it turns out to be elbow dysplasia. all in all its cost me £900 so far and the insurance wouldnt pay up cos when they had the vets notes it stated the dog had limped for 3wks and the insurance had started part way thru the 3rd wk, my fault for not takin it out sooner i suppose but i forgot. i wont be insuring again cos i reckon its a rip off

[Sprout]

You wouldn't expect to write off a car, then take out insurance the next day and they pay out would you? Think you've been unlucky though, elbow dysplasia will prob be an on-going life long prob and is in heritable.

[Finnish]

Rang the local vets today where my dog has been since she was a puppy,to see how much it would be for a hip score and eye test they said they would want £412.00 +vat.I felt like saying are you on drugs.So i put the phone down after a few words and i told the vet what i thought of his surgery.Then i ring Dick Best veterinary and the vet there tel,s me £115.00 pound,s.So is it just me or was some one taking the p:@s.How can anyone justified that sort of money.

Well my dog went to the vet's today.She had here hip score done,it cost me £92.60 so that's a right result.I will get the results back from the kennel club in 6 weeks.So if you shop around you can get it cheaper,and Dick Best is a very good vet.

[Sprout]

Hope results come back as good news. Definitely good price you got there, hip scoring is one of the worst jobs for us to do, the requirements are so strict as far as positioning for the xray that the last one I did took 9 xrays. The previous one I got lucky first time!

[Finnish]

Hope results come back as good news

Thanks so do i.Will let you no as soon as i no :wink: .

[RabbitHawker]

SOrry to get on my high horse, but I hare whinging every day. Vets are the poorest paid PROFESSION in the UK.
In any profession or trade there will be the odd bad apple, but don't tar us all with the same brush.
Euthanasia is always an emotional issue, and we are not mind readers, we often deal with couples who cant even agree with themselves what they want. I will always tell an owner if I feel the animals quality of life is compromised, whatever they may want to hear. However the more difficicult cases are the ones where it is general old age deterioration, and one day is pretty much the same as the next, it can be hard to decide what to do then.
Prices charged vary from practice to practice, one of the factors missed by most people is the higher expactations people have nowadays, there is a huge amount of equipment neede to run a modern high tech practice.
For example an ultrasound machine costs around £15,000, the loan and servicing for this needs to be met from the fees charged. This rarely happens, so this is a money looser, but people expect us to have one.
We also have 2 flexible endoscopes, one with video recording, so we can show clients what we have found, cost, again £15,000.
Then we get onto anaesthetic monitoring, in the old days, just a stethoscope, now Pulse Oximiters, blood pressure, capnography.....the list goes on, but the anaesthetic death rate has dropped considerably in the last 10 years to the state where I happily abaesthtise my birds to fit tail mounts etc.
You cannot compare vets on price alone, you need to look at the service offered and levels of equipment and monitoring, and the premises. the choice is yours, if you want bog standard go for it, if you want the best, pay for it.

[Mr_Colin]

My Mother-in-law had her horse put to sleep and cremated, she didn't want to open the vet bill but it was less than £300 all in. This was for the injection, call out(out of hours), collection and cremation. Quite a bargain at a difficult time and the vet even waited a month before sending the bill.

[BlackHawke]

Vets are the poorest paid PROFESSION in the UK.

sorry rabbithawker but this just isn't true. if u mean poorest paid professionals this still isn't true!!!

i mean no disrespect either rabbithawker. i know most vets do a sterling job! but like everything else it just takes a few bad vets to give the whole profession a bad name.

[RabbitHawker]

FACT vets are the poorest paid PROFESSION, that is comparing to other professionals -doctors, dentists, solicitors etc. these facts are on public record.
The veterinary degree lasts for 5-6 years, and includes placements during most vacations, preventing temporary jobs. Currently vets are graduating with average debts of around £30,000. many vets start work on a salary of around £15,000, with long hours and considerable weekend and out of hours work.
I am sorry that you are unaware of this, but it is true.
Chris

[BlackHawke]

so u dont consider nurses as professionals then coz i think you'll find they are!!!!!!!!!!! qualified nurses are on less than that and work a dam site more hours! including regular nights and weekends and have a dam site more responsibility than a doctor!!!!!

oh n how many nurses do u know get a free house n car allowance thrown in with the job!!!!!???????

basic nurse training is 3 years if u wanna specialise u can add another 18 months normally for EACH extra skill or a conversion.

there are also nurses who owe just as much in debt as a vet or any other proffessional!

[BlackHawke]

i apologise rabbithawker i'll get of my high horse now :oops:

[RabbitHawker]

Profession is an old definition, but it is in the dictionary as opposed to a trade. Vets are the poorest paid profession.
Wormers from the supermarket do not contain the same drugs as are in most wormers used by vets. It's like saying all wine is the same....
The flea products from the supermarkets are even worse, some of them are meant to repel fleas!!, a complete waste of your time and money.

[RabbitHawker]

I've got nothing against nurses, veterinary nurses are an essential part of my team, and we could not cope without their valuable input, and yes veterinary nurses are paid even worse than human ones, along the same line that doctors are paid more than vets...

[Sprout]

Well said rabbithawker, got someone to back me up now! My fiance is an unqualified HCA at the local hospital and only gets paid 7p/hour less than me when you add all the hours on call/weekends etc together!

[Renton]

Entry level jobs in most professions tend not to be brilliantly paid. I have two relatives who are vets; their first couple of jobs as associates were the usual very long hours and not great remuneration. That was 20 odd years ago, they started their own practice and are now a lot better off. Plus they can now employ associates to do all the nasty late nights and on calls!!!

[Debbie]

I had no idea Vets were so poorly paid in relation to the amount of learning/qualifications they have to attain :shock:

HCA's at our local hospital get paid £6.86 per hour and 12 hour shifts are the standard hours as are alternat night and day shifts and weekends and xmas etc are just normal working days.

As for the debt well most people have that and to be able to have the choice of going on to further education that is a choice that you make and if able then a choice you are also very lucky enough to be able to choose.

To better ones self and to enrich ones life takes money no matter how you look at it and that always means debt.

Work and Earn or Pay and Learn

Debbs xx

[Sprout]

Guess we'll have to move down south, my fiance gets £5.25/hr as a HCA

[Debbie]

Guess we'll have to move down south, my fiance gets £5.25/hr as a HCA

Don't think about it do it - she can have a job at Bournemouth, Christchurch or Poole Hospital tomorrow if she wants it all three major hospitals are within 18 miles of each other with B'mth in the middle.

Housing prices down here are on par or alittle more with parts of Cheshire I know as I have been monitoring prices around the Chester area 60 mile radius for about 3 years now.

If you want property papers just shout and I will send you some, that goes for anyone as i am always happy to help.

Debbs xx

[Mr_Colin]

[
If you want property papers just shout and I will send you some, that goes for anyone as i am always happy to help.

Debbs xx[/color][/quote]

Property Papers, send me the deeds to your house Debbs. Your too kind. :lol: :wink:

[Debbie]

[/quote]
Property Papers, send me the deeds to your house Debbs. Your too kind. :lol: :wink:[/quote]

Nice try Colin my sweet but NO :lol: :lol:

I am helpful but not that much :wink:

Debbs xxx

[SecretSquirrel]

there seem to be massive differences! i work in a vets and no, im not a vet and not rich, and our hip scores are in the region of £120. if sucessful on first visit and dependant on the drugs used and such. the after care for any ops are free and the decision of the owner is respected should he ever wish for euthanasia.

[Skeld]

Just read this topic.
Was Rabbithawker serious when he said that he uses anaesthetic to fit tail mounts to his birds? I thought that any general anaesthetic had an element of risk when used, but hey I'm not a vet (not clever enough!)
Dave

[BlackHawke]

jade was put out when she had blood test the vet used just gas which i think is minimal risk i maybe wrong!!

[RabbitHawker]

Yes I am serious, I do knock my birds out to fit tail mounts as there is a risk, but in a fit bird with good anaesthetic and monitoring this risk is minimal. I fint it much much easier to get the glue where I want on a bird that is not moving around all the time, so I get the mount and glue exactly where I want. I tis stress free forthe bird, it's back on the fist after a few minutes, and I have even flown them later the same day.
All of the birds I take blood from are anaesthatised for the proceedure and these are sick birds, one has died under anaesthetic, but to be honest it was going to die whatever we did, and we needed radiographs and bloods to progress with a diagnosis.

[Skeld]

Try a casting jacket, the bird does not move around and it has no risk to it at all. One of my birds had an xray on a broken digit using a castig jacket without any movement

[Sprout]

I personally don't give anaesthetics to tail mount my own birds but agree with Rabbithawker in that an anaesthetic is often a far less stressful way to examine a sick bird than conscious. Rather than struggling and causing more stress with an already ill bird it is quicker, safer and less stressful to give a quick anaesthetic, perform whatever tests are required to get a diagnosis then wake the bird up.

[Skeld]

I agree with what you and rabbithawker say regarding sick birds, after all you are the experts. What I am talking about is normal falconry maintenance, there are novices out there that may think that they need to see a vet to put on a mount or imp a tail feather.

[Sprout]

True, as I said I don't give anaesthetics to cope/imp/jess etc my own birds. Still, it's not always a bad idea to get your new bird checked out by an experienced avian vet, especially for the novice who may miss potential life threatening conditions which may be exacerbated by the stress of initial training.

[BlackHawke]

i had jade checked out begginning of last season. blood and mute sample think it only cost me around £30. gonna do same this season just to make sure