Making a hood shy bird to the hood

[Adam Barrett]

Has any one got any tips or methods for training a hood shy bird to the hood?
Cheers :wink:

[GriffMJ]

tit bits from the inside of the hood

try to make sure that the hood is put on in one movement (this can be hard with hood shy raptor)

keep the hood on for moments and then take of and reward.

increase the length of time in the hood....and keep rewarding after the hood is taken off

Make sure that all you do involving the hood is positive reinforcement.

Above all.....make sure u have a hood that fits the raptor properley.

[ColdZero]

try hanging the hood on a hook/nail in the mews where she will always see it. After a while she won't take any notice of it and won't fear it...in theory

[Hawkmaster]

First question I ask myself is why do I want to hood the bird, if I can get away with it then leave it, because if the bird is bad you may cause more problems like a hawk then hating the bare hand too.

[Falconry Equipment International]

Is this hawk fully manned down? if so see hawkmasters answer, use a travel box giant hood rather than continuing to struggle with the hood and making things worse. if however it is unmanned well that is a different manner. competence in hooding is really important. hope this helps
J

[Gaz]

You hooded many birds coldzero :?:

[Mary Quite Contrary]

The way i did it was to load the hood and only fly or reward if the bird took the hood. As Griff said positive reinforcement.
It is like introducing a kite to bird. You have to make the bird associate it with food and good times.
Regards

[Varmint]

What sort of bird is it? or is this just a Generic bird question?

[ColdZero]

i have only trained one bird, and she didn't give me too much of a problem, just needed patience. But i learnt the hood in the mews thing from someone else.

[Adam Barrett]

it is a harris but i also thought this thread would be of intrest or help others

[Jack Merlin]

Edmund Bert was a professional falconer who specialized in curing his clients' hawks of various problems.

You can read how he cured hood shyness in "Training the Short Winged Hawk", advertised elsewhere on this forum! Or use the link below.

[Tim Laycock]

I have always found hood making(and I mean making to the hood not making hoods before the sarcasam starts :lol: )on a manned hawk easier in a darkened room, Sat down with the hawk fed a thimble sized crop (for a gos or harris). Then I give the hawk a tiring such as a turkey neck to pull at, Thus focusing the birds mind on the tiring not the hood though the bird is not so hungry that you dont get a look in with the hood.
Slowly I pull the tiring down into my fist so that only a small part is visible and place an old hood over it so the end of the tiring is visible through the beak opening.
I let the hawk pull at the meat once or twice and then as the hawk bends to eat a third time I tip the hood over the hawks head and draw the braces with one hand.
as soon as the hood is on I replace the tiring as smoothly as possible with a piece of liver and remove the hood when the liver is half eaten.
In my experience this has never failed if it is repeated for three or four days.
If done right the hawk thinks its magic (I suppose it is to the hawk- A hood that turns turkey neck into liver!)

[Jack Merlin]

Blackbird, that doesn't sound like a hood shy hawk to me.

Chapter heading in Edmund Bert's book:

"How to make a hawk hood well, that will not abide the sight of the hood, but bite at it, and with her feet strike at your hand and hood, bate, shriek, hang by the heels, and will not stand upright on the fist; and this shall be done within forty-eight hours, with less than forty bates".

Now THAT is hood shyness!

Only snag is, you'll have to buy the book to find out how he cures it!!!<vbg>

[Tim Laycock]

See what you mean about hood shy and its various defanitions Jack!

Also you should have recieved my letter requesting a copy and payment by personal cheque.

Where is my book god dammit, I need somthing to read soon or I shall have to start talking to the wife again. :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Tim Laycock]

How are we defining hood shy anyway :?:

I meant ducking, bobbing and perhaps bating to avoid the hood.
Ive never had to deal with aggresion while hooding.

[Jack Merlin]

Also you should have recieved my letter requesting a copy and payment by personal cheque.

Good man! Should be in the post. Books usually go out the same or next day following when the order is received the order.

Just don't tell everyone here how it's done! I need the money so I can buy one of those fancy bow perches.

[Shaun Byrne]

How are we defining hood shy anyway :?:

I meant ducking, bobbing and perhaps bating to avoid the hood.
Ive never had to deal with aggresion while hooding.

Aggression I can handle, its when they hang upside down "bat" style that p1sses me off!!

[Hawkmaster]

Yup that is how I hood my female.

hang upside down "bat" style

[Varmint]

I think a general solution to this one wont work as there is a world of difference between trying to get a hood shy Hawk and a falcon, hawks seem to have a more active and manuverable head than a falcon and seem to be able to avoid the hood just at the right moment by movement of the head and neck.

There is a great way for HH and Gos's not mentioned in any book (incl Bert's) but i would rather show it to someone than try to describe it, works every time and with carefull and deliberate daily routine, the bird becomes perfect to hood.

Maybe i can show someone far more articulate with the keyboard than myself and they can spill the beans?

It has to be said thow that there is no such thing as a hood shy bird, just one that has been badly hooded to start with!

[Tim Laycock]

It has to be said thow that there is no such thing as a hood shy bird, just one that has been badly hooded to start with!

Got to agree with that Varmint as I have never had a clean sheet eyass that wouldnt hood with minimal work.
Ive only ever had problems trying to smooth over another mans failures

[Jack Merlin]

My problem with KK is not so much hooding as unhooding!

When he hears the quad engine turned off, he knows there's a dog on point and starts "helping me" remove the hood by upward jumps every time he feels anything touching or near the braces. It is very frustrating and I have lost any amount of good slips by his "helpfulness".

Oh yes, and I tried repeatedly simulating the sequence but he is too cute for that!

Incidentally, Bert mentions several methods of hooding a hood-shy hawk and even if you've read the previous re-prints in olde englishe, I can guarantee you've missed some of the subtleties. For example, his description of how to hood a hawk is often quoted, but everyone who does so misses information in the preceeding pages which explains that the hawk has already been waked for 12 hours!

[Tim Laycock]

My solution to this "Helpfulness" would be a (non anglo) indian hood sewn up at the back like the ones used by indian and pakistani austringers.
No braces so you just pop it on and off.
I have used these on my spars and found them to be exellent.

[Jack Merlin]

I'm told the hoods with a couple of springs instead of braces might also be the answer.

I once made a braceless hood from Pakistani braceless hoods given to me by Ronald Stevens. It was a good fit for a female peregrine and I have it here now. No matter how hard the falcon shook its head, the hood just settled down tighter.

But that is the only one I ever got to work properly -- and I'm afraid the falcon took a dislike to hooding as a result. That's another problem. Experimenting the hoods to find the best fit will often make the hawk hood-nervous if not hood shy. Can't win. But I would never want to own a hawk that I could not hood.

I see an awful lot of beautiful LOOKING hoods these days, but not many that fit without a lot of trimming and tweaking. Some don't fit at all!

[Tim Laycock]

Alternativley you can use a standard anglo indian hood
(or any apart from bahreini style), draw the braces and then strike them to the point where the hood can be removed without disturbing the hawks head too much.
Then remove the hood and then lock the braces with a cable tie or two (sharp end outwards obviously)
I understand that this is a bit "Heath Robinson" but it means that you can use your usual hood without modification.

[Gaz]

When he hears the quad engine turned off
Keep the engine on then dude, :finga: :mrgreen:

[Adam Barrett]

Ive never had to deal with aggresion while hooding.

You should try it with my harris mate she is murder with the hood :oops:
(i know its my fault) as the first hood i had for her was to large :?

still after a few more methods of making a hood shy bird to the hood if anyone wants to help.
Cheers

[Varmint]

Persevere Baywing, it might be misery at the moment but hood the bird howver best you can prior to feeding or slipping and try to set some kind of routine toward a positive rather than negative.

Hooding Hood shy HH is hard which is why you need to practise?

Approach a local centre and see if you can pay them to get a few pointers on their birds? Practise and technique are everything!

Jack you old dog, just when Berts advise had fallen foul on your Gos, two young and wet behind the ears "Austringers" offer some good advise, Afghan style hood and dont turn the quad engine off!

Maybe the quad thing was a bit sarccy, but the rufter style hood might make all the difference? Francois has a spring hood that would fit your Gos, ask him to try it?

[Adam Barrett]

thanks for your reply varmint i think perseverance is going to be the only thing to do.
Allready had a few improvments today she doesnt try to 'attack' the hood any more as i am placing a tip bit inside the hood she is now starting to trust th hood and allow me to stroke her chest with the hood now i think it is just a matter of time and effort on my part.

Any more tips would be greatly apreciated.
Thanks

[Gaz]

:mrgreen:

[Jack Merlin]

Any more tips would be greatly apreciated.

I am sure Bert's methods work. But many are based on waking the hawk and as I work alone that only works on me! (I go to sleep!). I am convinced that waking is a very powerful tool indeed. Bert's treatise was first distributed to his friends who would have seen through anything that was untrue or didn't work at once. It was published later as a book by popular demand.

My own method of making a hawk to the hood is to handle the bird around the head very gently and as often as possible. I will close my hand gently around her head until she realizes there is no harm in it. Also, bring the hood to the hawk's head many times, stopping immediately she shows any signs of nervousness. I use the same technique to train a spar to tolerate being thrown from the hand.

There is an "escape distance" that must be eroded. For example, the hawk becomes nervous when the hood comes within 3 inches of her head. So you repeat, repeat, repeat the action of bring the hood up to within 3 inches, then gradually reduce this distance by a very small amounts as she tolerates it. Keep going and she will eventually tolerate the hood. Of course, you have to be able to read body language and anticipate what will provoke a bate.

[Tim Laycock]

:? young and wet behind the ears "Austringers"

Good grief :lol: Will it take another twenty years of training and successfully entering my hawks before the reverse of my ears are dry to the touch. :roll:

[Varmint]

Im affriad Tim, i will always rem the little boy you used to be! 8)

But compared to Jack, you are as described and hardly knocking on at 26 yrs of age? :shock:

Another 20 yrs? you've only just had 20 as it is youth! :lol: :wink:

[Falconry Equipment International]

Back to the thread( sorry to come in so late on this I had a rescue perxlanner that was hoodshy.. she would not allow a ahood anywaher near her, that was 8 years ago I wopuld say she had come round after 3-4 years but it was a reall struggle & occasionally she still has the ebeee gebbies

[Tim Laycock]

compared to Jack, you are as described and hardly knocking on at 26 yrs of age?

fair point :D :lol:

[Jack Merlin]

Quote:compared to Jack, you are as described and hardly knocking on at 26 yrs of age?


fair point

Wotch it.

Reference Screaming Jay's post, that does make Bert's waking seem like a very fast method of making to the hood!

[Falconry Equipment International]

Jack, in effect i used Berts method, but to make her steady took this long