HACKING

[Sparrow Hawker]

Do many people hack there birds?

If so would you say its only feasible if you live in the right sort of location i.e. in the country or would you say it's possible to hack birds almost anywhere?

Regards,

HH

[Hawkmaster]

You can hack almost anywhere, but use telelmetry.

[Coedhirion]

think some of the big breeders have stopped wild hacking now, around here we have wild gos and sparrowhawks so its very time consuming keeping track of the birds that dont return to the hack stations. Perhaps other areas of the country are safer. Plus if they are valuable birds in money terms it is risky. Just my thoughts...probably wrong :lol: :oops:

[Varmint]

Take it from me simon, you need the perfect location to hack a bird, not just any where will do if you want the hack to have some purpose and education as well as security!

Tame hacking is another matter which is what Paul is talking about, but still not without it's risk's?

[Falconry Equipment International]

I would not dream of hacking in my area, too many bigottrd old school gamekeepers apart from other hazards. This doe not mean to say I have never thought of it

[Shaun Byrne]

think some of the big breeders have stopped wild hacking now, around here we have wild gos and sparrowhawks so its very time consuming keeping track of the birds that dont return to the hack stations. Perhaps other areas of the country are safer. Plus if they are valuable birds in money terms it is risky. Just my thoughts...probably wrong :lol: :oops:

Some big time breeders have stopped (or didn't really start :D ) but they wont be selling any to the Arab market. The Arabs are only buying wild hacked birds now and demand video footage as proof. They wont even accept a pen hacked bird unless the price is drastically reduced.
Imagine having a dozen white Gyr and Hybrids all flying loose over the moors :shock:

I sure havn't got the bottle!!

[Bubo]

that is my dream, get a place right in the middle of nowhere so i can tame hack my birds! pure magic

[Shaun Byrne]

that is my dream, get a place right in the middle of nowhere so i can tame hack my birds! pure magic

Not a lot of point in tame hacking if you ask me Bubo, its just like free lofting on a bigger scale :D

Birds are hacked in as near a wild state as possible to get them fit and allow them to learn to hunt as they would naturally. They are then caught back up (hopefully) and are supposed to be superior hunting birds due to experience, fitness and a more mature mind.

[Bubo]

ooohh this may seem silly but do they come back

[Shaun Byrne]

Nope, they have to be trapped. They are fed regularly at the Hack site, normally on a hack tower with a permanent bow trap fitted. The young birds treat the tower as they would do a nest site and return regularly and to roost. Once a bird looks as though it is about to become self sufficient it is trapped and taken for training. Lots of very valuable falcons are lost at hack each season and the hack site locations are kept secret (ish).

[Bubo]

can they be hacked only once? would the bird be more wary if it was hacked a second time ?

[Shaun Byrne]

You crack me up Bubo but good question.

Once they've been hacked, in theory, they have killed and so are self sufficient so releasing them again would not serve much perpose except fitness which can be sorted once trained.

I dont think any falcon with half a brain would fall for the bowtrap trick twice so to answer your question I would say no.

You could put them in a Hack pen to keep some level of fitness but once wild hacked they are usually trained for hunting before the memory fades.

HTH

[Coedhirion]

Some big time breeders have stopped (or didn't really start ) but they wont be selling any to the Arab market. The Arabs are only buying wild hacked birds now and demand video footage as proof. They wont even accept a pen hacked bird unless the price is drastically reduced.
Mmmmm..sorry to disagree, i know i am an absolute beginner compared with most of you when it comes to falconry, but Nick Fox isn't wild hacking and his place is run for Arabs, an basically by Arabs, an I don't think there are too many breeding more birds than there :?:

[Shaun Byrne]

Some big time breeders have stopped (or didn't really start ) but they wont be selling any to the Arab market. The Arabs are only buying wild hacked birds now and demand video footage as proof. They wont even accept a pen hacked bird unless the price is drastically reduced.
Mmmmm..sorry to disagree, i know i am an absolute beginner compared with most of you when it comes to falconry, but Nick Fox isn't wild hacking and his place is run for Arabs, an basically by Arabs, an I don't think there are too many breeding more birds than there :?:

If you ever speak to Nick Fox ask him what proof he was asked for with regard to wild hacking at the last sale. He breeds for the Arab market I agree but there are breeders who outsell him and others every year, on price not quantity, due to their birds being wild hacked.

[Bird_Dog]

Coedhirion --

The "Arabs" want bird that are in superior condition and hacking is one way to get achieve it. Perhaps Fox's reputation with them is good, so they trust 'em.

Wild haking was a gray area in the falconry regs. The new regs make it explicity legal. If you wild hack a hybrid and lose it, for instance, there may be a risk of it breeding in the wild... or some fear they might breed. I think all captive-raised falcons should be tame hacked or hacked out in some way. It may help imprints the most.

-- BIRD_DOG

[Afshimo]

The birds off Nick Fox are pretty expensive. I got a price list:

Gyr/pere male: £750 - £1000
3/4 Gyr/saker male: £1000-£2500
5/8 Gyr/sakermale: £750- £950
Gyr/saker Male: £750-£950
female: £1300 - £2000
Pere: Male £500
female: £900
Saker: Altai male: £750
Female: £1500
Pere/saker: Male £350
female: £600
Gyr/barbary: male £750
Superior harris: male: £350
female: £500

Didnt know he hacked em lol, mind you, I havnt really checked the site properly. Will have a nosey...

[Coedhirion]

Thats the point he isn't any more yet they still make plenty of money, an thats the ones that are available for sale cos thay aren't already spoken for!!!!

[Varmint]

The real answer here is try flying a hacked falcon and then compare it to an eyass, and then decide how much more the hacked bird is worth to you?

I would estimate between twice to three times the value of the chamber raised bird dependant on the hack site and length of hack.

[Bubo]

You crack me up Bubo but good question.

HTH

:oops: :lol:

[Bird_Dog]

Hacking could be worth even higher than Varmit suggests if you consider another benefit. For instance, the eyasses hacked in Montana or places like that have to learn to avoid Eagles and other hazards. All to often I've seen a naive chamber rasied or imprint falcon chase a wild RT. How stupid! Lets watch it get killed because the falcon doesn't recognize prey from predator. Hacking can be risky, but the more the falcon learns the better of it will be in the long run.

-- BIRD_DOG

[Shaun Byrne]

I think the answer here is quality over quantity. I could bust my Ba**s all season and raise dozens of pen hacked falcons, sell them at a reduced price and make a tidy profit.

Or I could take my time, raise fewer falcons, wild hack them (maybe loose one or two) and have people queuing up to buy them at any price.

[Coedhirion]

Nick Fox's place is OWNED by an Arab.....consignments goin in an out all time. They have hack pens, but thats not hacking out wild to feed stations. they used 2 do that but not any more. Some are trained and entered, an another person I know, they all turned up an watched ...complete with tents etc. but hacked out they were gettin shot so it was stopped. hack pens are not the same as hacking birds (4 those few that dont know difference) :rolleyes:

[Mary Quite Contrary]

The birds off Nick Fox are pretty expensive. I got a price list:

Gyr/pere male: £750 - £1000
3/4 Gyr/saker male: £1000-£2500
5/8 Gyr/sakermale: £750- £950
Gyr/saker Male: £750-£950
female: £1300 - £2000
Pere: Male £500
female: £900
Saker: Altai male: £750
Female: £1500
Pere/saker: Male £350
female: £600
Gyr/barbary: male £750

I wouldnt consider these prices as expensive.
Superior harris: male: £350
female: £500

Didnt know he hacked em lol, mind you, I havnt really checked the site properly. Will have a nosey...

[Coedhirion]

thats prob. cos they are wrong color an mostly male an he wants to clear the place 4 new stock

[WireHairedPointer]

I talked to a friend about hacking a few days ago, he had a crazy but good idea: there are kestrels breeding near his house and he planned to put peregrine tiercels in the nest and let the kestrels rear them the last days and then guide and protect them during the hack. Sounds crazy but could work. What do you think?