Who would be interested in an EASIER way to track Birds?

[Hawkmaster]

Ever had a bird beeline for the horizon and leave you with a feint and slowly dying signal?

Here is a bit of kit being made by a friend of mine that can be left permanently in the car.

You simply plug in your normal receiver and when you are getting a signal it will show you the direction to drive in via a compass type LED display.

So you now can cover loads more ground and then get a bearing to tell you very accurately which direction to take.

What he would like to know is what would people be willing to pay for such a system? 8)

Below is a similar system but not as accurate as his. His has 32 LEDs.

[Adam Barrett]

Very nice 8)

[BrianM]

ooooooooooooo,,, niiiiiice

[Finnish]

Sound's good.. :wink:

[OutFlying]

Ever had a bird beeline for the horizon and leave you with a feint and slowly dying signal?

Here is a bit of kit being made by a friend of mine that can be left permanently in the car.

You simply plug in your normal receiver and when you are getting a signal it will show you the direction to drive in via a compass type LED display.

So you now can cover loads more ground and then get a bearing to tell you very accurately which direction to take.

What he would like to know is what would people be willing to pay for such a system? 8)

Below is a similar system but not as accurate as his. His has 32 LEDs.

Do you need an external aerial as well hawkmaster ?

[Sparrow Hawker]

Hi HM,

Great Idea,

How much does it cost him to make it? :wink:

Regards,

HH

[GriffMJ]

Nice...how much Paul?

[Hawkmaster]

Do you need an external aerial as well hawkmaster ?
Yes mate four of them to be able to get the direction spot on.

At the moment he has not finished spending on it yet so will let people know after we are done.

Nice...how much Paul?

Not sure that is why we would like to see what people would feel is a fair price?

You will get a unit for in the car and an antenna for the car roof and that is what is giving the hassles at the minute as it will cost nearly £100 just for that, done from bought off the shelf parts. He can make a rubbish looking one that is only £25. So now he wants to get it looking good, working well and be cost effective too!

So lets hear what kind of realistic money you would pay?

[OutFlying]

four aerials, people will think your the t.v detector van :lol:

[Hawkmaster]

Yes, but you you think you are right on track.

[The Late Lord Lucan]

Have you done a trial with it yet HM?

[HawkNorth]

seen something similar somewere

[BrianM]

seen something similar somewere
the Batmobile,, or Knightrider............ :lol:

[Coedhirion]

good idea, when my bird went missing 2 receivers would have possibly helped a lot (if it wasnt the transmitter that packed up) I followed the signal on foot, friend drove around to nearest road where we thought the signal had come from, but her reciever would not pick up my transmitter.
around here the price would matter a lot, many of the areas we hunt in dont have roads for miles. So by the time you got back to the car the bird could have travelled an awful long way!! Looks wouldn't be a priority, just the accuracy etc. an possibly the ease of taking antenae on an off roof. Trouble is the receiver also depends on the strength of signal given out by the transmitter.

[Hawkmaster]

Have you done a trial with it yet HM?

Not yet but hope to this week.

depends on the strength of signal

The theory is it should be better than a yagi, well not in theory, it is!

We think it will be £125 to £175?

[OutFlying]

what size are the aerials, are they mag mounted ?

[Finnish]

That's cheep enough,obviously to me the £125 bit sounds better :lol:

[Hawkmaster]

what size are the aerials, are they mag mounted ?
Standard 216 Mhz They can be magmount but we are looking to cut the price at the minute and they will knock the dough up by at least £40.

That's cheep enough,obviously to me the £125 bit sounds better
So you want one then? :lol: No we will let you know what it is like.

[Bubo]

that is excellent!!

[Hawkowl]

Sounds very interesting :)

[Falconry Equipment International]

Will they be doing a 173 Mhz version?

[Falconry Equipment International]

Hi Paul have you rec'd my Pm?

[Francis]

hello
as I was thinking to build myself such a thing, but beeing no electronic freak in anyway, I'm interrested too.
is a product already available ?
thanks

[Alberto Cabrera]

The great one I invent.
I congratulate you.:wink:

[Pete Smith]

Sounds like an exellent idea, wish i'd had one 2 weeks ago. Would consider paying £200-300...maybe more if it was effective?
Would possibly need to consider the following.

1)To be compatable with coax cable inputs for common recievers.
2)Antennas on the vehical roof would need to be stable, when attached.
3)Antennas shouldnt stick out past the roof line of the vehical (If possible). Will reduce the probability of the antennas getting knocked off by passing hedges/branches etc. (Have had this happen several times with roof mounted dipoles).
3)Minimise the number of cables going from the antennas to the control unit.
4)How to position the unit inside the vehical so that it is easily visable to the driver if on his own.

Let me know when you want an independant assesment
Pete.

[PeelsBells]

Very interested in the box still needs to be tested his he going to give one out to try so people can give accurate feed back for the forum as i am up for it LOL.

[GriffMJ]

Hi Paul

Put me down for one.... where can u get the mag mounted Yagis from?..... is the range of the unit as good as the transmitter? ie I have a 6v Luxy'

[Francis]

Hello

Any news about the doppler system ?

just to mention digital radio frequencies are just on frequencies used for falconry in Belgium and The Nederlands, 173-175 and 216 Mhz are useless nowadays.

400-440Mhz is the best option left. (and 433-434Mhz CE approval thing too...)

For the doppler project I have a few questions

- can it be battery operated and used in the field ?

- antennas ? would you need a ground plane too ?

- is it possible to interface with a computer (PC, even PDA ?)+ GPS and use a navigation system directly ? I'm using GPSS's DF feature in the car and it is very convenient. (see for example Doppler III, Picodop, and other such, details about GPSS here http://www.gpss.tripoduk.com/df1.htm)

added : even If I have to enter manually the direction (normal telemetry handheld with yagi) thru keyboard, and then report the intersection point in another navigation device, it is still for me a help, and the possibility to record also an aid too.

[Sandalar]

It sounds like an excellent system to me and if he can keep the cost down to around the £100 to £150 mark-ish he will be onto a serious proposition I think.
Most telemetry seems to be up in the £5-600 bracket which is what puts people off.
I think with that and a couple of transmitters costing say £250-£300 the system would be a storming success.
These estimates might be a bit on the low side but I think show a reasonable amount.and obviously the lower you can keep the cost the better.
It doesn't neccessarily have to look all pretty either if it works (look at porsche,they sell well:rolleyes: )

[Francis]

If you compare with products on the market today as kits, Ramsey Electronic DF, or Bob Simons's Piccodop, etc... price are about the 170$
Montreal Doopler and its variants are even cheaper (30$), but you have to build them from the PCB and chips your self and find all the pieces for it.

Problem is with those kits that were build on the Roanoake system, and that this works best with coutinuous signal, not a pulsed one as falconry transmitters. From the test I've done, you had to modiy them either by software with compensation techniques, or by construction, measuring simultaneously on all the antennas.

Theorically it is possible, as it should also be possible to determine the speed of the tranmitter and the distance from it, position and speed of the receiver know.

Could one come with such a system and display the resulting positions, directions and speeds on mapping software, that would be superb.

Then I wouldn't have to search in which neighbouring garden my falcon is on a kill. The only thing that would then remain unknown is whether the neighbourg pigeon fancier has his gun loaded or not. ;-)

Any news ?

[StormRider]

Hello

Any news about the doppler system ?

just to mention digital radio frequencies are just on frequencies used for falconry in Belgium and The Nederlands, 173-175 and 216 Mhz are useless nowadays.

400-440Mhz is the best option left.

For the doppler project I have a few questions

- is it possible to interface with a computer (PC, even PDA ?)+ GPS and use a navigation system directly ? I'm using GPSS's DF feature in the car and it is very convenient. (see for example Doppler III, Picodop, and other such, details about GPSS here http://www.gpss.tripoduk.com/df1.htm)

- can it be battery operated and used in the field ?

- antennas ? would you need a ground plane too ?
Francis,
I spoke to Robin about 3 years ago regarding his GPSS system. It sounded great at the time but was not compatible in terms of reading information. The mapping system was a manual system with the use of a yagi antenna. The individual would have to carry out the usual linage checks to pinpoint direction of bird. The cross points would be given a OS point and then the points would be typed into the mapping system. Where the lines crossed is where the bird should be. Seemed to be a very slow system using kit that was already available.
The system being advertised on this thread again is nothing new but is way better than standard RF directional tracking at the moment. This appears to be a copy of what has been used by the Police for years in way of the Tracker system. I used tracker for 5 years and on every track atleast 2 cars with units in had to be available to cross the signal.
I personally only see GPS as being the way forward for this application. I have been working with a friend of mine for 3 years now on such a system. At present we are trying out a GPS/RF backpack on compatibility with a mapping system to be used on laptop. The difficulties have been the reduction in size of the GPS data tag and the ability to pick up at least 8 satelites. Additionally, the power source being intermittent in order to prolong the battery life. Our first field trials will be towards the end of August due to a few problems we have had with cycling of the battery. The system should also be able to locate within 2 meters accuracy.

STU

[911]

Hello Mr. Hill;

What happened to this?

[Hawkmaster]

GPS/GSM basically:lol:

[Natch]

**** all by the looks of it :lol: