Best advice for a new falcon

[BlueHawk]

Alright people, my new hybrid arrives in about 4 wks, so it's all new to me, I've had the Harris going for a few seasons and everything's gone great, but a falcon, different kettle of fish.

I'm flying her at corvids, read as much as I can and am about as prepared as I can be (mentally), so you that have the experience, any gems of wisdom from me, something you swear by, or something you don't read in the books, or something you do yourself to get them going better. Oh, or even a recommendation of your Bible for some nighttime reading. All advice appreciated..

Big G.

[OutFlying]

Nick Fox's book is a good read.

[Hawkmaster]

A Larson Trap!

[Goldie]

A Larson Trap! :supz: :wink:

[Shaun Byrne]

The main difference will be the time needed to get it fit and keeping it thet way. Every other day at least.

Larson trap, Kite..............anymore?

[Varmint]

Be aware that your basic handling skills will be challenged and hooding techniques ect must be spot on, if you have little or no experience of falcons i reccomend you go along to a local school and try to get some hands on and hooding, worry about larsons and entering when you can train it and keep it in good feather.

Best of british! :wink:

[Falconry Equipment International]

Be aware that your basic handling skills will be challenged and hooding techniques ect must be spot on, if you have little or no experience of falcons i reccomend you go along to a local school and try to get some hands on and hooding, worry about larsons and entering when you can train it and keep it in good feather.

Best of british! :wink:
Well said Varmint, of course he needs to action this right now sow that he is confident of hooding the hawk correctly when his new 'charge' arrives. he also needs to have a well fitting hood( & preferably someone with appropriate expertise to help mould the beak opening especially, to make the hawk feel comfortable. IMHO the best time to start hooding a falcon is as soon as it is out of the pen/chamber so that it is an automatic part of the training process. Hope this makes sense

[Hawkmaster]

Another aspect that REALLY needs to be learnt throught experience is luring. I use it on all falcons no matter which path you take to train it, pursuit or as a gamehawk.

[BlueHawk]

Sorry chaps, I thought I was well read, but what is a Larson Trap?
And thanks for the advice, already have Nick Fox's book. Are you talking about his new one?

[OutFlying]

Larson trap, have a look at the recent posts - couple of photographs, they are corvid traps. Maybe you could feed your falcon on a couple of very freshly killed specimens.

The Nick Fox book I refered to is the one you've already got but the new one is more relevant to crow hawking (I think, not read it yet).

[RabbitHawker]

what hybrid are you going to fly, they all vary in hunting ability and speed, for enclosed hawking pere/saker prob. best, but open land allows others.

[BlueHawk]

Hi RH

female pere/saker.

[Tallons]

Larson trap, have a look at the recent posts - couple of photographs, they are corvid traps. Maybe you could feed your falcon on a couple of very freshly killed specimens.

The Nick Fox book I refered to is the one you've already got but the new one is more relevant to crow hawking (I think, not read it yet).


if he wants fresh corvids he would be better with a 22air rifle , dont confuse things and turn it into a guessing game , the larson trap will enable you to cach live corvids as for when you want to start your falcon hunting quary you have a live bird to do it with , hence a baggy ..............

[Wightwings]

behave Tallons you know we dont use them here :shock: :roll:

[ScotsFalconer]

philip glaciers 'Falconry and Hawking' is the bible of all falconry

[OhMyGod]

philip glaciers 'Falconry and Hawking' is the bible of all falconry

twoddle

[Ben C]

As in Philip glacier mints? they were great, I can't believe he made those as well as fly budgies. Did the man have no limits?

[Goldie]

OMG and BenC, you must remember the lad is only 15 and Glaziers book was prob the one he was advised to buy as a starting point

[Ben C]

No you miss understand, I am not taking the **** out of him at all. I think he is right mate. Just saw Galcier/ thought mints. Cmon Me Take the **** out of a child........I work with 600 of the little monkeys everyday.

Anyway I sent I PM to say sorry.

[Varmint]

philip glaciers 'Falconry and Hawking' is the bible of all falconry

Yep Great book, but not a patch on Nicks book when it comes to Rook hawking information, in fact if memory serves me right, glasiers book only talks about roook hawking for a bout 1/2 page!what other books have you read Scotsfalconer?

[RabbitHawker]

Nick Fox's new book on rrok/crow hawking is really good, more info on how to achieve classic ringing flights than more enclosed rook hawking, but can't beat it.

[KevGem1]

what is nick fox's new book on crow hawking called thank's KEV.

[Tallons]

philip glaciers 'Falconry and Hawking' is the bible of all falconry

Yep Great book, but not a patch on Nicks book when it comes to Rook hawking information, in fact if memory serves me right, glasiers book only talks about roook hawking for a bout 1/2 page!what other books have you read Scotsfalconer?
shut up mr holgarth , who are you to say whats ,what ? ha look at your own book , its **** ! at the end of the day theres two kinds of falconer , one in it for the sport and the ether is in it for the money , phill glaser was in it for the sport of it !!!! nick fox is a money man , :evil: ! there is a big difrence , nick fox the man who actually had the brass neck to take the air force to court and win ! he did so not for the the conservation of the bird but for los of ernings ! i think it was something around £80,000 per year ! he clamed that the jets or was it helicopters scared the birds during breeding season , :shock: yup thats yer mr fox for ya ! he was well named (FOX) now what was you saying varmit :?: by the way its all taxpayers cash he was awarded whare els does the cash come from ..... yep even in falconry we have corruption and capitlism , its not about quality its about quantity

[M & J Raptors]

Talons

I think you will find that it was martin jones, who had a pay out from the MOD, for low flying aircraft disturbing his birds during the breeding season, do not know if NF had also ?

Billy

[OutFlying]

philip glaciers 'Falconry and Hawking' is the bible of all falconry

Yep Great book, but not a patch on Nicks book when it comes to Rook hawking information, in fact if memory serves me right, glasiers book only talks about roook hawking for a bout 1/2 page!what other books have you read Scotsfalconer?
shut up mr holgarth , who are you to say whats ,what ? ha look at your own book , its **** ! at the end of the day theres two kinds of falconer , one in it for the sport and the ether is in it for the money , phill glaser was in it for the sport of it !!!! nick fox is a money man , :evil: ! there is a big difrence , nick fox the man who actually had the brass neck to take the air force to court and win ! he did so not for the the conservation of the bird but for los of ernings ! i think it was something around £80,000 per year ! he clamed that the jets or was it helicopters scared the birds during breeding season , :shock: yup thats yer mr fox for ya ! he was well named (FOX) now what was you saying varmit :?: by the way its all taxpayers cash he was awarded whare els does the cash come from ..... yep even in falconry we have corruption and capitlism , its not about quality its about quantity

Even with your views about both authors, Nick Fox's book goes into greater detail regarding flying falcons at crows/rooks - fact.

[OhMyGod]

"Even with your views about both authors, Nick Fox's book goes into greater detail regarding flying falcons at crows/rooks - fact."

An ideal book for mentally preparing yourself prior to picking up your first rook hawk

[KevGem1]

i have asked previously but does anyone know the title of the book by nick fox ?
cheers kev

[Ben C]

Martin Jones did the right thing! Thats a lot of money, and you can have a balance between money and sport. The world is full of very rich and very talented sportmen/women.

KevGem, isn't it the one with him and the bunch of arab horses he flies with daarn south. He had the book/video at the falconers fair.....****** whats it called????

[OhMyGod]

Kevgem1

the book you are interested in is called.......

Classical Falconry: A Treatise on Rook and Crow Hawking

[OutFlying]

With a title like that, I wonder what the main topic of the COMPLETE BOOK book will be ?

[OhMyGod]

£110 new

[KevGem1]

thanks for the title but i think its a little pricey for me thanks KEV. :o

[Varmint]

shut up mr holgarth , who are you to say whats ,what ? ha look at your own book , its **** ! at the end of the day theres two kinds of falconer , one in it for the sport and the ether is in it for the money , phill glaser was in it for the sport of it !!!! nick fox is a money man , ! there is a big difrence , nick fox the man who actually had the brass neck to take the air force to court and win ! he did so not for the the conservation of the bird but for los of ernings ! i think it was something around £80,000 per year ! he clamed that the jets or was it helicopters scared the birds during breeding season , yup thats yer mr fox for ya ! he was well named (FOX) now what was you saying varmit by the way its all taxpayers cash he was awarded whare els does the cash come from ..... yep even in falconry we have corruption and capitlism , its not about quality its about quantity

What are you going on about mate?

Not only have you gotr your facts completly wrong, your also harping on about something that has nothing to do with this thread, and only serves as a wind up, which makes me think that you are once again one of the brave facelss individuals who makes this sport so warm and friendly bvy your pop at arms length approach!!

It is about quantity Tallon, but luckily for you there are surgeons out there able to help you out with your own particular Little prob??

Whats your name by the way? it's not "Justin" is it? :lol:

[Goldie]

[quote="Varmint
Whats your name by the way? it's not "Justin" is it? :lol:[/quote]

No its not just in :lol: he's been here 3 wks and managed 3 posts :wink:

[OutFlying]

thanks for the title but i think its a little pricey for me thanks KEV. :o

Buy it, read it and then sell it.

[Tallons]

shut up mr holgarth , who are you to say whats ,what ? ha look at your own book , its **** ! at the end of the day theres two kinds of falconer , one in it for the sport and the ether is in it for the money , phill glaser was in it for the sport of it !!!! nick fox is a money man , ! there is a big difrence , nick fox the man who actually had the brass neck to take the air force to court and win ! he did so not for the the conservation of the bird but for los of ernings ! i think it was something around £80,000 per year ! he clamed that the jets or was it helicopters scared the birds during breeding season , yup thats yer mr fox for ya ! he was well named (FOX) now what was you saying varmit by the way its all taxpayers cash he was awarded whare els does the cash come from ..... yep even in falconry we have corruption and capitlism , its not about quality its about quantity

What are you going on about mate?

Not only have you gotr your facts completly wrong, your also harping on about something that has nothing to do with this thread, and only serves as a wind up, which makes me think that you are once again one of the brave facelss individuals who makes this sport so warm and friendly bvy your pop at arms length approach!!

It is about quantity Tallon, but luckily for you there are surgeons out there able to help you out with your own particular Little prob??

Whats your name by the way? it's not "Justin" is it? :lol: sory got some names mixt up , but at the end of the day what i said is true , varrmit its folk like you whos going to get falconry band in the uk , and if you want me to enlighten you on why i think this and menny other falconers think the same , its just as you confirmd its all about quantity not quality , guys like you breed to line your pockets , you will sell bop to enyone who comes along with the right amount of hard cash , now if you think that conducting yourself in this way is good for falconry then you shouldnt have nothing to do with falconry , falconry is about one man and his bird its not about one man and his money making sceme , the two just dont go together , you might try and fire back and say that theres a lot of talented folk out there that have devoted there lives to BOP , i say bolox ! the only way they have devoted there lives to bop is because they are making a living off of it (cash) , now some of you who are wreading this post might think ! hey whats wrong with that ? ile tell you shall I , for one it is holding back! us !true falconers from getting back the right to capture and release bop , i say getting back the right as if i have acualy in my life time had the right to trap and release a bop , :shock: varmit you know what ime on about so lets just leave it at there, :idea: :arrow:
and please why do you want to know who i am , have you been such a messer that you dont even know who you are talking to ! and by the way ! yern book is ***** , only a ***** like you could **** it up :lol:!

[Ben C]

Err it can't be TRUE if you got the names mixed up.

How can it be anyones fault (RE catch and release), if the laws are not in situ in the first place. Which came first, a ban on taking hawks from the nest or breeders selling their products. I am sure there were breaders of BOP's way before people were prevented from taking BOP's.

You wouldn't criticise dog breeders for selling their products would you? What about horse breeders or even fish breeders. What about those who breed finches instead of taking them from nests?

The problem lies with changing the laws, not the idiots who do sell **** poor hawks to **** poor hawkers. As for wanting to take hawks from a nest......what purpose?.......better footing ability?......You could always move abroad Tallons, USA, Canada, New Zealand?

On a personal note, I liked Varmints book, and don't for one minute think I am stupid, or not clever enough to differentiate between dross and a solid guide for newbies mate. :) :) :)

[Varmint]

Thanx for the kind words Benc, Tallon, i have sold 13 birds commercially in the last 5yrs, you may be confusing me with someone else? if i was a big breeder i would still ask for details of accom ect , as i have done for several of the members here.

Your just trying to lash out mate, but i dont really know why?


What parts of my book didnt you like exactly and why? i would reccon you havent even read it mate, but it's easy to have a pop from a distance eh?

Never mind! i dont expect everyone to like it but would it have helped if i had written it all in small easily to read words for you?

Commercial falconers have been around for a long time mate, and for your info i dont earn my money from breeding, i earn it from educational days of which i do several thousand, all of which are designed to let the public know what exactly is involved in the sport and how much hard work and dedication is needed.

several of the members here stated off on my days, so is that bad for falconry?

Like it or not, it is the commercial falconers who will dictate most of the public opinions about this sport , so it's time to support and embrace them mate? thank god our future isnt in the hands of a mindless biggot like you mate!

Like it or no, ill continue to do what i do, even if it's just to wind up pillocks like you Tallon! :lol: 8)

[Steve L]

Tallons i speak to a few people that know adrian all from different hunting backgrounds and they all speak very highly of him as he is a very respected man and dont believe for one moment he is in it for the money,i personnely think you are jealous as adrian has got something that you will never have :!:

[Varmint]

Thanks steve.

If you really know me you'll know that i have built up all the birds that i have by hard work and sweat.

I started from a council house in Sheffield, and am now living the life i always dreamed of, so could you, but it takes hard work and bottle.

I here ewhat your saying about commercial breeders which is why the Federation of Professional falconers will only allow breeders to join if they agree to supply written documentation of the quality of the bird they supply, chech that the new owner is fit to own the bird they are selling and provide a detailed fact sheet on the birds exact dietry requirements.

This is about as much as a responsible breeder can do in this day and age?

I put in a lot to get a lot back and have several apprentices each year to whom i "Give" away my bird rather than sell them. In fact i know of two forum memebers who have been given birds by me FOC!

Sight hound is buying one of my birds at the moment but he will tell you that i am preparing him FOC for his new bird on weekly visits, all for the princeley sum of £300 (and that includes the bird and most of it's furniture.

If i was in this for the dollar, i certainly wouldnt train for free every person who buys my birds??

You Tallon are like so many others who find their way into falconry, sad,frustrated, bitter, and without a clue as to the real reason we all do this sport, Love.

I love every part of my job, from seeing what the baby falcons i breed fly and hunt like, to wathing the smile on a childs face when he comes face to face with one of my birds for the first time, it all good stuff.

Sadly, this pleasure is contsantly denied to me by falconers who seem to think that no one else should ever own a bird, let alone allow others to derive pleasure from it!

I have in my life spend most of my waking hours in the company of my birds, and not once ever have i had reason to pity them, but i have met several falconers who's attitude have made me pity them?

Sorry you feel the way you do mate, time will help!

[Hawkmaster]

I stopped reaDING THIS THREAD ONCE TALLON MADE HIS SECOND POST AND I am sure as hell I recognise that unique literature, full of style, gramatic excellence and absolule BILE!

Welcome back HAWKAHOLIC!
host213-122-213-213.in-addr.btopenworld.com

I will say this once and once ONLY I personally have covered your a r s e too many times so either you sort you s h i t out and be nice on here like everyone else or leave! I am not saying you have to agree, BUT be care of how you say it.

[Varmint]

Best advise for a first time falcon?

Go and see a professional Falconer. If they cant help you, they will tell you someone who can.

[Woody1966]

Tallons, I don't know Adrian personally but having read both his and your posts I know who I'd rather meet. It's true that everybody is entitled to their opinions, I just wish that you would keep yours to yourself!!!! :finga:

[Liam]

Welcome back HAWKAHOLIC!
host213-122-213-213.in-addr.btopenworld.com

I don't think it is right posting the users IP address up on the forum, but it doesn't prove it is him anyway because it is not a static ip.

213.122.213.213 is a dynamic IP adddress i.e. so any number of (btopenworld/ btinternet) users could be assigned that IP throughout the course of a day with normal connections/ disconnections.

[Ben C]

Bluehawk,

Out of interest how have you prepared for your new falcon other than reading and obtaining permission? I ask this without ANY knowledge of how to go about it, so please do not feel I am tricking you or anything.

How for example have you prepared for using a lure, do you go out and swing it everyday? I would be frightened of smacking my new falcon. I think Moritz said he borrowed a falcon that was a bit slow off his friend and practiced with that.

Have you practiced putting your hood on a static hawk/mould or do you use the hood on your harris? And how do you think your Harris has helped you prepare? And what would you have done more of with your harris to prepare for your new hybrid?

As I say, I ask as someone who is contemplating balancing out my groundhawking, with a falcon that gives good flights on the abundence of feathered quarry that Cody misses.

Thanks

Ben :D :D :D

[Hawkmaster]

I don't think it is right posting the users IP address up on the forum, but it doesn't prove it is him anyway because it is not a static ip.
YES look the member up and then tell me you disagree, besides I have already and it is only a gemneral one anyway as you said, I have a better one than that.

[Tallons]

Tallons, I don't know Adrian personally but having read both his and your posts I know who I'd rather meet. It's true that everybody is entitled to their opinions, I just wish that you would keep yours to yourself!!!! :finga: just as i thought a magpie , always atracted to the bling bling @dog .....

[Woody1966]

nah... just repelled from the obnoxious!!!

[BlueHawk]

[quote="BenC"]Bluehawk,

Out of interest how have you prepared for your new falcon other than reading and obtaining permission? I ask this without ANY knowledge of how to go about it, so please do not feel I am tricking you or anything.

How for example have you prepared for using a lure, do you go out and swing it everyday? I would be frightened of smacking my new falcon. I think Moritz said he borrowed a falcon that was a bit slow off his friend and practiced with that.

Have you practiced putting your hood on a static hawk/mould or do you use the hood on your harris? And how do you think your Harris has helped you prepare? And what would you have done more of with your harris to prepare for your new hybrid?

As I say, I ask as someone who is contemplating balancing out my groundhawking, with a falcon that gives good flights on the abundence of feathered quarry that Cody misses.


Good point BenC,

You're absolutely right, I've never flown a longwing before, but I am out swinging everyday (no wisecracks..) and the Harris has been going to the crow lure for sometime now (Yes, I know it's not the same) . No I've never hooded a bird either, so that will be new to me too. But luckily I do have a pro falconer who has been my mentor for a number of years now who has been a great help for all the stupid and not so stupid questions I've had.

You asked what extra preparation I'd done with the Harris, well they're apples and oranges really, apart from the husbandry, it would be difficult to get away with half the stuff that I do with her compared to a falcon, having said that I am a bit more meticulous about weight and food than some others.

I'm not really a club person, in fact the forum is probably the first exposure I've had to more than two or three falconers (not all of them stand up guys- just read this thread!) but thats the thing about advice - you can take it or leave it..

So it is with some trepidation that I'm starting with the longwing, but as you said about balancing out your groundhawking, I have some prime ground for the black stuff, launching the Harris out of the car window to mug them isn't really hawking. Hopefully, this will give me a better season by being able to concentrate on different styles, I'm trying to always improve the bird, my technique and style and weed out all the dross from the good information that I read in books, on the forum and 1st hand from others.

I don't expect everyone will think this the best approach, but neither will I be replying to them with the vitreol that has frankly amazed me the past few weeks. There's some great falconer's out there with some good advice, but their ego seems to give them delusions of grandeur.

[Mary Quite Contrary]

Good post BH.

A JOB WELL BEGUN IS A JOB HALF DONE.