what can you enter sakers on??

[UKJay74]

hello peeps curiosity has got the better of me
what can you enter sakers to ???
i love these birds and want to know more about em ::D any answers appreciated

[Hawkmaster]

Blocks, mews or ummm . . . not much really! :lol: OK OK rooks, pheasants, but they are not great, better crossed with Peregrine, then they are great!

Hey what has happened to your avatar?

[Coedhirion]

Kites, lures..... and fly them all summer while the hawks in the moult!! They are brilliant little birds!!!

[RabbitHawker]

they can make good rook/crow hawks, but for the drier months of the year

[Saker-Clive]

They also will take ground game, rabbits etc. It's not easy but they will :mrgreen:

[Falconry Equipment International]

Blocks, mews or ummm . . . not much really! :lol:
Hm Had same thoughts myself &...... Kites, lures..... and fly them all summer while the hawks in the moult!! They are brilliant little birds!!!
Ch & then let them migrate come the Autumn :lol: :shock: :lol: :lol:
( Happened to a haggard that was imported when I was in my teens seeled eyelids & all) :(

[Varmint]

Best way to fly a Saker is pick it up this season and fly it hard to the lure and kite if you wish, keep it going thru next spring and then enter it on May Rooks and Crows.

Allow it to gain experience with it's young quarry, late moult in July/Aug then back out the following May, to start all over again!

Flying Falcons at ground game is in my opinion, unthinkable! especially if you wish to keep any tail feathers and primaries in tact.

Just got no style about it and cheapens a noble, capable bird!

[Steve L]

Are you thinking about getting one jay?
If so when?

[SakerJack]

Steve L, Varmint,
As one who flies sakers at ground quarry, may I add that a flight at a hare, where the falcon stoops 10-20 times over a distance of a mile and 1/2, is just as dramatic as a peregrine waiting on at 1,000 feet and stooping to a flushed quarry. It is all in the eyes of the beholder. The bird works just as hard if not harder trying to daze an animal that may be 5 times its weight. As well the dog if you are using one,, works just as hard as a pointer or flushing spaniel.
I do agree that are probably not the best choice for crows, rooks on your side of the pond, and they are certainly not for everyone,, but when a saker is wedded on a particlar quarry they can become quite fanatical.. try them at hare or rabbit, you will not be sorry you did.

[UKJay74]

never realised me avatar was missing hm :S varmint when you say pick up this season what age should i get one at??

yupps steve i am thinking of getting one :D it is driving me nuts at the moment my harris and owls are moulting so cant do anything :(

thanks for the info peeps

[Will]

Blimey Jay, how many have you got now??
How are the buzzards doing?

[UKJay74]

lol i have a european eagle owl the bengales a male harris the buzzards have gone to a friend as i am due to move the end of this month and i didnt want to stress the buzzards out too muych with the move

[Coedhirion]

get a Saker you know it makes sense :lol: :yawinkle: :lol:
the one we fly at the moment is a real crackin little bird an great fun, like Varmint said we gonna fly to kite and lure then may be enter it next year !!

[UKJay74]

coedhirion what age did you get your saker at ?? is it imprint and how is it going??have you done a diary ?? i am very interested in sakers an as my other half has a barn owl on order i think its only fair i get another bird lol

[Shaun Byrne]

coedhirion what age did you get your saker at ?? is it imprint and how is it going??have you done a diary ?? i am very interested in sakers an as my other half has a barn owl on order i think its only fair i get another bird lol

Not being funny mate but have you any experience of longwings? Have you had the MHH hunting yet? Have you got the time to fly all your birds? Have you got suitable weatherings/mews for them all?

Not being negative, just devils advocate. :twisted:

[Varmint]

Id agree JAy, your not really ready for a longwing yet, get a few seasons with your M Hh under your belt first mate.

We can all go out and buy the birds, but you'll start becoming a collector rather than a falconer?

Saker Jack, i breed and fly Sakers and have done for more years than i care to remember and i have no interest what so ever in hunting ground game with a falcon, sorry i must be just sad eh but i put a lot of effort into producing them and i have no interest in seeing them smashed up?

If you can catch an adult Brown Hare here in the Uk with one, thats what your bird would look like too, if you havent got enough game for a longwing, dont own one, if you have fly it in the style!

[Athene]

Well, for 3 centuries the "style" was to fly a cast of saker or a saker and a gyr at hare for almost one year, achieving extraordinary long and beautiful flights, before moving it to heron, kite, etc here in spain. There are even whole treatises on that subject talking about the benefits of hare hunting. Nowadays hares are the only big quarry (what we call a "pressure") aviable for falcons in spain. I don't think it is so unholy.

[UKJay74]

hi h4wka at the moment i have no experience of longwings the mhh hasnt been hunting yet as he has only ben here with me since beginning of his moult . time flying the birds is not a worry as i work for myself doing web design and dedicat alot of time to the birds i already have here once my move is completed i will have all the weatherings/mews there as i will be building a few spare on top of what i need right now

i understand you playing devils advocate mate and the reason people need to ask these questions as so many birds end up messed up by people who cant cope or mess things up :)

[UKJay74]

Id agree JAy, your not really ready for a longwing yet, get a few seasons with your M Hh under your belt first mate.

We can all go out and buy the birds, but you'll start becoming a collector rather than a falconer?



Adrian mate this is the start of a lot of research sorry if it sounded like i was getting one now :roll:

i would love to get a longwing but not for a while till i feel my experience lever is right .

[Ben C]

Will you fly the bengal owl, eagle owl, buzzard and Male Harris everyday after the moult? I only have a male Harris and I cannot, hand on heart, squeeze another bird in. I fly him everyday and I don't even drive to my land. Maybe in five years time I could get a longwing and fly them on alternate days, but thats pushing it. I would never pass my bird on so I have the pleasure of 15 years of his company. And I finish work at 3pm and only live 6 miles from home. In the winter I struggle to get an hours flying in. I would have a serious long, hard, deep think about what you are doing....and I mean this in the nicest, friendliest possible manner. :) :) :)

[UKJay74]

hi ben at the moment i only have te bengal , european and harris i no longer have tyhe buzzards .

yes i aim to fly them all everyday after moult and am lucky to have a fiancee that will be flying the bengal as he is rather attached to her :D as i say this is research for when i have the experience to take on a longwing

[LanczSpringer]

BenC

And I finish work at 3pm and only live 6 miles from home

How can you live 6 miles from home? do you have two homes? or just like working that muchyou think of it as your 2nd home? ;-)

[Ben C]

Yes mate, a girlfriend certainly helps....:) :) :)....still reckon you'd have your work cut out, I am in a similar position as you really, and I bet I am thinking the same things as you, in terms of how to balance out my rabbit hawking.....as I say though to hunt my harris properly takes a bloody lot of time. Apart from in deep deep winter, takes about 2-3 hours hunting a day and up to 6 hours on a Sat and Sunday. After which I am too bloody knackered to walk even. :) :) :)

[SakerJack]

Saker Jack, i breed and fly Sakers and have done for more years than i care to remember and i have no interest what so ever in hunting ground game with a falcon, sorry i must be just sad eh but i put a lot of effort into producing them and i have no interest in seeing them smashed up?

Varmint,
I totally respect your decision not to fly sakers at ground quarry, no problem here and certainly not sad eh!. But as I said in my last post the flight is all in beholder.
Emperor Fredrick II of Hohenstalifen when training gyrs to fly at crane recommended flying the gyrs at hares in early training. If I may quote.
"is that no other flight is more resembles the flight at a crane than that learned with a hare" This type of falconry has been around for centuries, it was the falconers of the Middle east, Tukmenistan and many other Central Asia countires that needed meat in the diet and this was the way to get meat.
My saker has hit and tussled with over 35 of our jackrabbits and although she has knocked them senseless and fought hard with them on the ground she has never once broken a feather, if done properly and with out being carless and with help of a hound your bird should come out unscathed. I am sure many a gos, harris hawk even a ferrug has had feather damage while trying to subdue your Brown hare.
Dan O'Brian falconer, author, from Monatana flew female gyrs at whitetailed jacks and with the help of a saluki flew them throughout the whole year..
Varmint not argueing just not agreeing with you on this, it is after all one of the oldest forms of falconry.
Sakerjack

[Moritz]

I would love to go with gyrs for hares, but you are not allowed to use dogs to take prey so that won't be possible. Perhapse it would be possible if you fly them in a cast.

It is Fredrick of Hohenstaufen or the proper way "Friedrich der Zweite von Hohenstaufen".

Moritz

[Adam Barrett]

What possiable quarry is their in the uk for a sakret?

I would imagine that most are to small for rooks and crows?

Just curious
Thanks

[Ali]

Long wings are really a passion to fly if youve got availibility of land than you enjoy the flights of sakers i mainly fly them on houbara, the flights are long and you get a good look of the stoops and chase between the 2 birds though a saker should be fast if shes got to get hold of a bustard coz they are damn good and speedy birds.
Ali

[Adam Barrett]

What possiable quarry is their in the uk for a sakret?

I would imagine that most are to small for rooks and crows?

Just curious
Thanks

[OhMyGod]

Adam

No the sakret is not too small for rooks. In fact if you have an eyas and train it to fly at rooks from the outset never giving it chance to go up or self hunt you will find the sakret will take them WELL.

I'm not sure how well you would do if you have been given a second hand sakret or you have a bird in its second or third year that has not been entered on rooks before, as it will be hard to get this type of bird successfully taking rooks, and think this is where many illusions of sakers not being able to take rooks are born.

If you have an eyas this year and want to take rooks read up on how to do this in various threads and elsewhere, set youself and the bird goals and fully understand what it is you want to achieve and how you are going to get there and I'm sure a sakret will do you well and take many rooks in good style.

hope this helps

good luck

[Varmint]

Varmint not argueing just not agreeing with you on this, it is after all one of the oldest forms of falconry.

And variety being the spice of life mate, i just dont get any sense of wonder or magic from this style of flight Mate?

I am well aware of the style in which Sakers are flown around the world and their historic values, but i actually like my birds, they are my friends as well as my hunting partners.

Why should i put my friends in harms way when there are alternatives that do appeal to me? #

I'll stand by what i said about Longwings and groundgame mate! :wink:

Adam Sakrets can be demon on a variety of corvid species, especially in tight conditions as they can turn on a sixpence, but do need a couple of seasons to really sparkle.