what supplements needed for harris hawks

[Moses]

just a question i wanted to ask

if one has a harris hawk

and u feed it only on chicks, day old turkey poults , occasional beef and also quails


but no mice and rats, i cant imagine cutting their tails etc and gutting them to feed the hawk, feeding a snake is different u just put a live one in or a defrosted one without gutting or cutting tails

but if one doesnt want to feed it mice and rats

what other supplements can u feed the hawk ti give them the same nutrients


cheers

[Finnish]

Why would you not want to feed your bird rat and mice, because you dont want to gut things is that what your saying. And you should really gut quial as well.

[Shaun Byrne]

Why would you not want to feed your bird rat and mice, because you dont want to gut things is that what your saying. And you should really gut quial as well.

And what about when your burd nails a rabbit, could you dispatch a squeeling rabbit and then gut it still warm?

If not then why have a Harris Hawk?

[Shaun Byrne]

but no mice and rats, i cant imagine cutting their tails etc and gutting them to feed the hawk, feeding a snake is different u just put a live one in or a defrosted one without gutting or cutting tails



cheers

You might want to edit that mate

[Moses]

rabbit is easy to gutt coz i eat it and no probs at all same as qual its a bird, its easy to kill something u eat yourself

but a thought of cutting tails and uughh and gutting a mouse and a rat, man its making me feel sick :D


im sure theirs alot of falconers who dont feed them rats and mice, in pakistan and the middle east they dont, just birds and beef and quails etc

[Jiff]

i think you may be entering into the wrong game mate, don't get me wrong we all have a concience, and we all have things we can't stomache, mine is.............well nothing springs to mind, but the point being if it's ok to gut a rabbit it's certainly ok to gut a rat, or anyother creature that is required to be gutted it's all psychological mate, to be honnest i aint been gutting my rats, the bird nails a rat in the wild it aint going to gut it before serving lunch is it, i do send my mute samples in though and so far have had nothing to be worried about while feeding un-gutted rats, having said that the rats i feed are small not the great ben sized things. as far as food is concerned the lot goes in regardless of food type.

[Finnish]

Start eating rat then mate. :lol:

[Moses]

mate i got no probs feeding it a whole rat and mouse :D i used to feed them to my snake

its the gutting part, and your right it when they do hunt in the wild they do eat them whole and spit them out

reason i asked was i just dont like mice or rats, specially their tails and insides and man their feet

i luv hamsters their a different story their nice as pets but not to feed a hawk haha :D


well what vitamins and supplements would u feed a hawk not on mice my friend

cheers

[Kornie]

Im pretty sure im right in saying that mice don't need gutting as its not really worth it, remember though, if your bird wants to gut something it's perfectly capable of doing so itself, as for rats I know what you mean, gutting a rat is a bit stomach churning and focking rank, but the more you do it the less painful it becomes, for the sake of a few seconds work its not worth avoiding rats.

the bird nails a rat in the wild it aint going to gut it before serving lunch is

I have witnessed Trinity gut rabbits first hand when allowing her to feed up after a kill, she has done it when I have fed her whole quail as well, Trin often leaves a nice pile of giblets next to her dinner!

[Moses]

nice one kornie, if thats the case , just feeding a mice whole, its cool by me

its easier to take a chick out of a box full of alot of chicks than to see pink tails everywhere and squeezed faces and bodies frozen rats and mice

[ColdZero]

imo, instead of finding an alternative to feeding rat, just gut the bloody rat and stop being a baby :lol:
To be honest i didn't gut anything other than quail. All the food was from honeybrook, so no risk of poison. I did check the liver for white spots though but i never found any. The reason i never gutted them is that my hawk did it anyway, i gave her an entire rabbit (opened up) the first thing shed do after plucking at it a bit would be to maticulousy remove all the guts. Seemed strange as it seemed so wasteful, how did she know mshe wouldn't eat it all?

[Moses]

lol :D hmm i can only try man , will see how it goes :D

first, must train for some more gutts before i gutt anything :D

will tell u what happened, when i had that lugar saker for a week

well i bought a box of chicks and i dont know what happened but i saw those lil poor things and felt emotional, they were so furry and nice poor lil ones :D but nature took over when the bird started flying to me to feed on my glove, man the sport of it, beautiful bird ripping it out into pieces and swallowing it, i think i was more happy coz i managed to get it to fly to me and eat from the glove, but im sure i enjoyed the sight of the blood as well
man to hold a rat or mouse on my glove is a different story i would have never done it

maybe its cool to feed just in the mews during feeding time, but chick on glove was cool 8) its nice to see an animal feed on a whole carcasse than silly stripped and cut beef and pieces of meat

when they rip it to pieces them self, its a joy to watch

[Coedhirion]

mmm well I'd be happier feeding the mice & rats, taking the yoke out of DOCs is what I hate most, not cos its fluffy, by the time they have defrosted they are just yellow damp food for my bird.

[North East Harris Hawker]

this has got to be some kind of joke!
here moses, if you dont like gutting the "cute creatures" post em to me and i'll bite em in half for you meself!

mice, chuck em in whole, if you dont like cutting up rats (cos they stink)
freeze em and chop em in half with a spade
then throw half a rat in when they are thawed.
most birds swallow mice whole but dont eat rats guts.
so you'll end up picking them up off the aviary floor anyway.

my suggestion is to buy smaller rats if your not happy cutting the big fellas up,
8)

[Goldie]

my suggestion is to buy smaller rats if your not happy cutting the big fellas up,
8)

My suggestion is buy a parrot and fed it friggin nuts :lol:

[North East Harris Hawker]

mmm theres food for thought :roll:

[Finnish]

buy a parrot and fed it friggin nuts

Good one :lol:

[Moses]

my suggestion is to buy smaller rats if your not happy cutting the big fellas up,
8)

My suggestion is buy a parrot and fed it friggin nuts :lol:

haha nice one :D i just bought a couple of lovebirds in the weekend lol well i feed em near enuff that and seeds :D

[North East Harris Hawker]

during the moult/breeding season i do give my birds a more varied diet than during the hunting season, i also give supplements, namely calcium (egg production and for growing youngsters) along with A1 raptor.
i dust food every other day with it

[Finnish]

I have never given any of my birds supplements before and there all fit and healthy.

[North East Harris Hawker]

thats cos you spend all your money with martin jones :wink:

[Finnish]

:finga:

[Moses]

during the moult/breeding season i do give my birds a more varied diet than during the hunting season, i also give supplements, namely calcium (egg production and for growing youngsters) along with A1 raptor.
i dust food every other day with it
thanks mate :D


martin jones aye, i bought a creance , haha it was nice but its a door handle with a string, could have made it myself, i was kicking myself afterwards when i checked the price :D

i thought it was gonna be something fancy, or maybe it was the scots side of me :D

[North East Harris Hawker]

i think MJ charges a tenner for his catalogue :shock:
talk about milking the sport.... if everyone else can make quality kit at a reasonable price why cant he? greed. thats why.

[Moses]

true bud

[GDN]

I never fed rats to my HHs. It's not that they bother me. It's just that when you remove the tail they remind me of ferrets. I just don't want my bird getting the same idea out in the field. My HHs get fed DOC quail rabbit and pheasant if there is any about. I have to admit the first time i had to deal with rats i was not that keen on them. Now - who cares it's only a rat. Even the smell when gutting them doesn't bother me.

Moses in answer to your original question about suppliements i use raptor essentials - 3 times a week. They seem to do ok on it. My vet recommended it to me and he is an avian vet.

[Moses]

thanks alot gdn u my type of guy, cheers a million :D

[CastleFalconry]

Why would you want to remove a tail??

[ColdZero]

i use raptor essentials - 3 times a week. They seem to do ok on it. My vet recommended it to me and he is an avian vet.

i bought some at the fair, how would you rate it? I am not sure if i will ever need it, is there any noticeable difference in a growing bird would they grow stronger bones or bigger, anything like that.

[GDN]

I have always removed the tail of rats. I don't think there is very much in it as in goodness. I am also scared in case the bird has trouble digesting it or it gets stuck. It was how i was shown in the beginning. It depends on the bird though. Falcons and large owls the tail is taken off. For eagles the tails are sometimes left on. For falcons i also remove some skin depending on the size of the rat. I find the skin very tough and i am scared in case the bird has trouble digesting it. I also remover the stomach and intestine but leave the other internal organs for all of them.

As for the raptor essentials. I have never fed it to a growing bird so i don't know of the benefits on that side of things. As i said i do give it to all my birds whether they are flying or in moult. The reason i do it as i said was i was advised by my own vet but also the vet who did my zoo licence inspection. She did advise i use a suppliement of some sort. I do try and use it sparingly though. I don't take the attitude of 1 pinch is good 2 must be better. I would like to think that it does give there system a bit of a boost.

The whole nutritional thing is abit complicated due to all the opinions and to some extent the myths that go around. I have read a booklet recently on Nutrition by Neil Forbes which made some interesting points. At the end of the day though if your bird seems happy flying well and looks healthy then you are are doing somehting right. The trick is to ensure that lasts year in year out.

[BlackHawke]

i've had my old female harris for 2 seasons now first season i used no supplements at all. i started using raptor essentials end of august last year. i have done regularly since then.

last season jades moult was slow n steady finished moulting beginning sept. this year i dont know whether its coz she started her moult late or the supplements but shes dropping them a dam sight faster this year. quite noticably. shes lost 9 tail feathers in the last month n half the new ones come thru fast

jade during the moult is rather picky with her food. with DOC's she wil attempt to pluck the chick! with quail she guts her own