martial eagle whats in there prey list?????

[Matt]

we saw one at a show last weekend and it bloo us away. it was teatherd like the avian version of hanibal lector. massive perposfull looking feet and very active on its bow looking about shifting weight and generaly looking like it wanted to kill and eat anything within the show ground..
could any body tell me a bit more about this amasing bird and what they have achieved with falconers here and abroad..
all the best matt

[OhMyGod]

I used one for display purposes only, she flew at 7kgs, but know they have been flown at impala, jackels, and a whole host of prey similar to our deer they have been known to take prey far bigger than you would expect. I could not imagine they would be of much use in this country as they need a lot of themals and height to hunt. In SA most people fly black spars and peregrines, and see eagles as a training bird, like our buzzards so they are rarely flown. Males are big birds but the females are massive birds, and their blue feet make goldies feet look small. Their feet are not as strong as the crown eagles which are about 4 kgs but they are a bigger foot and the largest eagle in africa.

They don't really like taking off unless they can fall off a cliff, and I imagine they would be difficult to get up over hear, however they are powerfull and get up to speed quite quickly if they have the motivation. They have a totally different wing to say our sea eagle which is broad and can hack about the coast quite easily using ridge lift, marshalls have a longer narrower wing and in africa get up in no time but hear I think they would suffer being out of their natural habitat.

[Matt]

wow thanks thats the sort of thing im talking about .. good solid info there thanx again "oh my god"
as you put it they can take bigger game than you would think, could they take fox in the uk ??? i only ask as there is talk of taking eagles out with the hounds to overcome the hunting regs.. i would imagine that the law would state that the speices used would atleast be able to take a fox even if it was ever slipped . im sure the hounds would take the fox in an accidentle manner .
just a thought ...
personaly i would love to try one at night on fox muntjack ect .. mabe one day .
all the best matt

[Hawkmaster]

Monkeys and small children!

[Sean]

HM im gunna have to report your post to a mod :roll:

[Moritz]

I hope that nobody ever tries it with the hounds and the fox as that would be bad for falconry. Why use martial eagles if you can use golden eagles? They are much better for the european countrysite.

Moritz

[Sean]

why use any eagles, would be dangerous to the hounds and vice versa

[Hawkmaster]

Why use eagles at all?

[Moritz]

Why not it is very good sport to hunt foxes with eagles and it aids natural selection.

Moritz

[Matt]

wow i think some of you guys got the wrong end of the stick ... its not about the type of eagle at all that was just me asking if they could take fox . and if it did aid the hounds to carry on hunting then i think it would be a good thing , but of caurse the eagle would never be slipeed if the hounds where in hot persuit ...
i was a skinner and helped with the belvoir hounds from the age of 11 years so i dont want to see it come to an end .
i have been on horse back with the hounds on manny ocasions often the fox is 3 to 4 feilds away from the pack offering plenty of room for the eagle to do his thing..
again its just my point of veiw and im not here to battle with any body ovr it .
all the best matt

[Wingless]

We fly a male martial eagle in demonstrations, he's mainly flown at a motorised lure from some distance. It's unfortunate because where we're situated there are just too many dogs to let him do his own thing.

Originally we let him do what he liked in the demos but he ended up chasing foxes (which we have in abundance down here!) on more than one occasion, he didn't catch any but obviously felt he had a chance! He was a year old when imported and clearly had plenty of experience.

When closed to the public in the winter months we fly him from the fist at hares which he has no problem with, infact they are amazingly agile. We also have a pair, we've never flown the female but she is monstrous!

Robbie

[OhMyGod]

matt

If this is what you want to do (take foxes) I would not waste my time trying to get the marshall up on a pitch. You would have to get it up pretty high and you would get very frustrated with the bird as it is not designed to do what you will be asking. They soar around the open planes and don't really go in any trees. They could take foxes with ease as they take jackels which are bigger. They can take deer that stand over a metre high, I have a pictur of one somwhere taking a buck in the wild which makes the eagle look tiny.

What you really want for foxes is crowned eagle, I am not certain of the weights but I would say the females are 4 - 4.5 kilos with feet smaller than the marshall but much stronger. The crowned eagle has such strong leg muscles, you would never get one off you even with many people pulling it's tallons out. It is by far the strongest eagle in africa and has wings of a similar shape to a gos. Basically it is a 9 or 10 lb goshawk. It hunts in the tree canopy darting through the branches taking agile monkeys, it will reach top speed very quickly and because of it's power it can nearly fly directly up!

These birds are amazing and will be better in the uk than a marshall by far. The marshall does look good though sitting on the fist being the same size as you.

[Wingless]

I have to agree, i certainly would never bother flying a martial eagle in the UK as a hunting bird, i just do so as part of my job. They really don't suit this country and the temperament and brains don't match that of a golden eaglem, which would be my preference over any other eagle for hunting with, in Scotland certainly. Although i'm sure many of the hawk eagles, like the crowned, would be excellent, i prefer to see eagles hunting from a waiting on position. I'd love to see these pictures of the martials hunting ohmygod!

Robbie

[RabbitHawker]

I've seen one on dikdik in Tanzania, and been out with a friend flying one at Hares, it was keen but unlucky. It would be more than capable of taking foxes, but we should not encourage the foxhunters, all we will get is trouble, there is too much risk of damage to the bird, hounds or public by flying one in those circumstances.

[OhMyGod]

we need a bigger country!

[OutFlying]

wow thanks thats the sort of thing im talking about .. good solid info there thanx again "oh my god"
as you put it they can take bigger game than you would think, could they take fox in the uk ??? i only ask as there is talk of taking eagles out with the hounds to overcome the hunting regs.. i would imagine that the law would state that the speices used would atleast be able to take a fox even if it was ever slipped . im sure the hounds would take the fox in an accidentle manner .
just a thought ...
personaly i would love to try one at night on fox muntjack ect .. mabe one day .
all the best matt

This has been stopped, no hunts will be hunting with eagles and hounds.

[Matt]

this is a controversial topic i know lads . one mans opinon is not the same as anothers . so thanx for your opinions on fox hunting and lets keep this about just the eagles as i realy enjoy learning new stuff and this is when the forum is at its best for me.
back to the eagles im not thinking of going out and getting one just yet so save me from that stuff .. but who breeds them in the uk ?? more importantly who flys them (other than you guys ) i would love to spend some time in the company of such animals as mentioned and would be happy to travle to spectate......

please lets have some more info on any part of the training manning hunting ect of eather species (crowned/ martial)..
i realy am fasinated by them whitch is funny cos i much profer smaller birds to fly out of choice....

all the best matt

[CroFalco]

Hi mates!

Why always must be some very smart aleck who, due to his personal frustrations, doesn't like some bird and is always trying to blackbite it and adjust his opinion perforce into all others head...?
It is so sadly that some, almost 40 years old falconry master, still can't resolve, that magical Pandora's box - why to use eagles at all?
I'm not master at all but solved that scruple when was 15 years old...

All the best, crofalco


P.S. http://www.falconryforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=3751&start=0

Yeah, it would be a real good way to continue our new year of this forum, where everyone includes MAINLY constructive contributions, instead of tripe and banter, ALL THE TIME...Agree, but forgot to answer that better idea would be if the forum posts counter would count only replies with 4+ words lenght!

[Matt]

crofalco . dont let them bother you there is a lot of heros on the forum as is the world over.
egnore them .
i wish that i could enter in to a discution on any subjuct in another language and be passionate about it . i take my hat of to you and agree with your statments .
somthing one of the pro falconers said to me on this forum realy ****ed me off and if i ever meet him i think i will break his jaw !!!!!

i cant understand not all but manny of the pro falconers all ways trying to belittle other not so skilled members . they seem to want to constantly desplay there pedagree in falconry terms. if so wise and so long practising as they claim they must have seen the likes of us many times over and surly by now would not get so exited about putting us in our place.
also the same guys that talk of flying eagles as a desplay of the cock size are the same guys that fly these birds and preech of ill practise.
this is aimed at one guy in perticular and i dont think as yet he has posted on this thread so anybody that has please do not take offence.
matt

[ColdZero]

...

[Moses]

u wouldnt wanna really **** with this eagle

http://www.meyers-naturfoto.de/bilder/Afrika13.jpg

just ask the hog :D


http://www.africaguide.com/images/library/wildlife/mm006.jpg


a martial

http://home.versatel.nl/wimenviv/images/martialstnbk.jpg

[OutFlying]

if you only want an eagle to get out fox hunting then that doesn't seem fair on the bird. How exactly does that even work? all those hounds somehow leave the agle alone on its kill?

Coldzero,
It was an attempt by the hunts to get round the hunting with dogs act, but it is now a non starter.
OF.

[ColdZero]

...

[Moses]

oh thats good, i bet a lot of eagles would have died if it went ahead.

and i am pretty sure that eagle is screwed in that first pic, but its a good one.

lol u reckon, it may have flown up and then dug its talons in the hogs eyes and kicked its ass :D i think it was after the baby hog and the mama came to confront the eagle

[ColdZero]

...

[Kornie]

Getting an eagle hunting is one thing, getting it to work with a dog I feel is pushing it, has anyone managed this?

[OhMyGod]

From the little experience I have with getting eagles hunting I found the most tiresome part was getting the thing fit. I have only seen this in south africa and due to the temperature and the eagles metabolism they are either flown every 2 or 3 days or they are fed practically nothing on a daily basis which is not much of a reward for an eagle in training. One chick a day or somthing. not much for a bird that could eat 30.

After I had been there for a season and met a few people I went to help a guy starting a centre in the drakensburg mountains. During this time we were given a female crowned eagle which was due to fledge in a couple of weeks. It was fitting servearly as it had been hand fed beef for many weeks and had calcium defficiancy. We got it right and started lamping with it the same as the african hawk eagles. To get this bird fit we would stand on the balcony high jumping it about 4 metre or so, nearly straight up. With this type of bird you can get it fit easily using this technique but the black eagle and martial were hard to get fit. In SA they can just flap a couple times and glide into a thermal inches off the ground then go up out of sight effortlessly in minutes . Very difficult to get them to burn energy or get fit. The quarry you are hunting are constantly looking for eagles as they are natural pedators so it can be difficult to flush for an eagle waiting on, and seemed much better to get the thing fit and fly it off the fist as you could flush into clearings with the dogs instaed of just bush to bush to bush etc with the eagle gatting narked. There is no way an english pointer can keep up with those springbok or similar, so you need to get them into the open unaware that there is an eagle around. There is country there that is open for miles but I never got to hunt with eagles thyere and when I went driving through I never saw much to hunt anyway.

The martial and black eagles are huge birds and I'm sure they can make good hunting birds for falconry purposes as it has and is being done there now. However for me I would rather use a crowned eagle if I were to fly an eagle.

In this country I have only seen african hawk eagles take rabbits and hares and they are not very big birds at all and are absolutely nothing like the large eagles. I think you would struggle to make a success out of a goldie, or black or martial eagle in the U.K. unless you were in scotland and even then I think perhaps native species would be much better suited. Could you imagine a 15, 16 lb hungry aggressive hunting Martial eagle on the loose flying overhead as you are walking your collies in a country park with the grandkids?

[Moses]

warthogs are dangerous *******s, the eagle probably flew off, or if it had any pride it would have swooped round and grabbed a piglet before leaving.

How could you fly an eagle in england thats capable of taking down a pig? even remote areas usually have sheep, it seems very confusing considering the size of this country.

probably bud but of course i have to take the eagles side its the my daddys tougher than yours situation but def the hog would have done something nasty the eagle was brave enuff to stand ground but dont know for how long

no bull bud, ask ali he will tell u, when the eagles fly around the farms in pakistan the parents make sure the kids are indoors, and u do get alot of wild hogs their too in the cotton fields , theirs an old myth which i dont believe the eagles swoop down and take your eyes out, i think someone made that up to scare the kids not to go and wonder alone :D and get lost

i was born here but when i go for a holiday its nice to see the wild birds, their are alot of green parrots their with nice red necklass patterns their

something like these

http://www.great-trips.com/newsite/green-parrot/jupstup300.jpg

martial eagle is that the most fierce one u can get mate


cheers

[EagleMan]

hey people, what do you think, is martial eagle stronger, or usualy bigger than golden eagle ?
impressive bird.....

[Tr1gger]

somthing one of the pro falconers said to me on this forum realy ****ed me off and if i ever meet him i think i will break his jaw !!!!!

i cant understand not all but manny of the pro falconers all ways trying to belittle other not so skilled members . they seem to want to constantly desplay there pedagree in falconry terms. if so wise and so long practising as they claim they must have seen the likes of us many times over and surly by now would not get so exited about putting us in our place.
also the same guys that talk of flying eagles as a desplay of the cock size are the same guys that fly these birds and preech of ill practise.
this is aimed at one guy in perticular and i dont think as yet he has posted on this thread so anybody that has please do not take offence.
matt

Was there really any need for that?

[MattSpar]

Those that ask for advice should, perhaps, make allowances for those who's style may seem a little dictatorial. The older ones amongst us were brought up in a different world. I myself have the unfortunate habit of lecturing long after school is over!

[Maxell]

Kornie said:-
Getting an eagle hunting is one thing, getting it to work with a dog I feel is pushing it, has anyone managed this?

Martial, Crowned and Verreaux's (African Black) eagles have all been flown successfully at quarry in the UK in recent years, dogs have been worked with all 3 at times without much problem. Good falcons don't fly at check, Good hawks dont take ferrets, Good dogs drop to the flush, Good eagles don't take dogs. Its down to the experienced falconer who knows what he is doing.

[Bibou]

Hunting with the eagle or not, at least it provides some shade :yawinkle:

Oh, and that hog actually closed in. Who knows what ever happened? Any other pics of that sequence?

btw. the eagle has something in his fang, just dirt, or a little piggy?

[Minty]

Love em!......................... MESSENGER FROM HELL!

[MickeyDredd]

Oh, and that hog actually closed in. Who knows what ever happened? Any other pics of that sequence?

btw. the eagle has something in his fang, just dirt, or a little piggy?

I saw a further pic in the sequence of the Martial in the stand-off with the hog which clearly showed it had nail a piglet. The photo either won or was a close runner-up in a wildlife photography competition a few years back.

[EagleMan]

well friends, so what do you think wich is more stronger and has bigger talons the martial or the goldie?