Redtail or Harris

[Harris110773]

hi people i live in mid wales and i cant make my mind up on weather to get a male/female redtail or harris can you please give me your thoughts thanks form the scouser in wales

[Harrisii]

hi people i live in mid wales and i cant make my mind up on weather to get a male/female redtail or harris can you please give me your thoughts thanks form the scouser in wales

harris110773,
i take it this is your first bird, if so then suggest the harris as a first bird.
not just because its easy to train, quick to tame, has a great temperament, learns quick but because its pound for pound the best all round bird for novises and and experienced people alike, and it can hunt and peform like no other. if you want a diverse experience go for the harris. it will follow you, fly from trees, from the fist, slope soar, work with ferrets, dogs, etc and can take a huge range of quarry species. perfect. but please dont think that this species will just be enough to get you started. if you put the work into these birds you can acheive so much. they aint "just beginers birds". they test the knowledge and skills of more experienced falconers too.
redtails are good birds but require a stronger hand, more time dedicated to it, have been known to be temperamental, (although not all of them) and are naturally agressive birds, (sometimes towards the falconer).
harris' hawks, once tame stay tame and done require the same level of time spent on them.
what i suggest you do is listen to all the advise you can get and make your own mind up. dont take any one persons word as gospel and go with it. mull it over and come to the decision on your own.

i suggest some reading:
"complete rabbit and hare hawk" martin hollinshead
"a pasion for harris hawks" martin hollinshead
"the harris hawk" william harris
good luck and best wishes.

[Jazz1]

Hi harris110773, Like harrisii i to would say to go for a Male or female Harris for a first time bird for all the same reason's that Harrisii said.It is up to you M8 Male are faster than female's if you like send me a PM with your address and i will send you a copy of a Dvd that will show you what a good well hunted Harris can do. Cheers

[HunterPaul]

Im not gonna big up the harris here I dont need to,a well conditioned harris needs no-one to blow its horn...but please dont go for it because it is an easy option....you will learn (if learning about falconry is what you are after)so much more about falconry from a red..... the beauty and the tragedy of the harris is its very forgiving nature, so it will allow so much slack management..then when youve finished with the bird and think your an expert...you move "on" (god I hate that where harris are concerned ..move on my arse..) to a proper bird (and beleive me do a harris right and you will have no need to move on) then you will really appreciate why they so wrongfully call the harris a beginners bird, when it really should be labelled the most versatile bird in falconry...so versatile even a numpty can do it (badly).. so by all means go for a harris, not because its easiest, but because you really want a harris...go out see a few birds of different species with different falconers fly, and you will then, hopefully come to the right decision for the right reasons...
not bigging up the harris....that is me under enthusing about its abilities...

[Flying High]

This is where i am probably going to stur things up. First of all i would have to agree with most of the thing that have already been said and the harris and yes if you do pick one have a male they are more fun, BUT in may eyes RED TAILS are better to start with. The reason for this is that they take more time more patience and i feel you learn more from them and if you spend the time they will turn out just as good as a harris. that will mean that you can fly a bird just as good as a harris but you will not be the same as everyone els. My first bird was a red tail and i learnt a lot. I know people say harris can do and can't catch as much as a harris but that is a lot of rubbish. The red tails i have work with and trained have slopped sore, followed on, followed through tree, worked of the fist, hunted out of the hood, worked with dogs and ferrets. and they have caught almost everything from rabbits and pheasent. This is just my opinoun but i do feel that red tails are so under estimated.

[Dave G]

i agree hf if more novices had the red as their first bird then i think they would learn alot more as you carnt rush a redtail more time and patience is required which then has the novice giving alot more respect the the bird or ouch nailed by a redtail is not a good think, a harris gives a novice to much space to make mistakes so when they move on to other birds the same respect is not given as it should be there for the bird suffers

[Kanati]

[QUOTE=hunterpaul]Im not gonna big up the harris here I dont need to,a well conditioned harris needs no-one to blow its horn...but please dont go for it because it is an easy option. QUOTE]

If you chose a harris and get it wrong, they can be a long way from 'tame' or 'easy'. They can be nasty little gits!...for this reason, dont buy a second hand bird. If its mature and for sale, there is a good chance that someone f*#ked up somewhere along the line and doesnt want the hassle of a badly trained Harris.
Get on a course first or find someone who will train you. make sure you have your whole training session worked out before you start, with your aims and how you are gong to achieve them, and find someone near you who can help.

I aquired a male harris (came with the famale I wanted) and he was still not flown free after more then a year! He was...still is a bit...scared of the bare hand, so feeling his keel scares the **** out of him...I wish i knew what the previous owner had done to him!!! I have got him going free and things were looking up and yesterday, while out flying him for a bit of exercise he came out of a tree from behind me and as I looked round he smacked me in the face. I have a cut on my eyelid and a cut jsut under my eye! So be warned...get it right from the start, and think twice before getting a second hand bird.

[Colohen]

I have to agree with Hunterpaul!
In the US we have to start with a Kesteral or Red-Tail Hawk, by law. If your Red-Tail Buzzard is any thing like the US RTH, as it is my understanding.Then it would be a excellent bird to test your skills and patiences. With the harris, as wounderful and forgiveing as they are, are agressive hunters and may suprize you!
My preference would be the FHH but it may be better for you to see thoes in your area and what they have and how they my help, if you need it. You should also consider the area you have avaliable to fly your bird, type game to fly on etc.. etc..
The RTH/RTB is quite versital but I think the HH is more so! Just my opionen. But you also have to consider what it is you really wont ? Look real close at the advise from Kanati befor making your choose, eather way! In the end you have to be happy with what ever you chose or you will not be doing yourself or the bird any good!:supz:

[Minty]

Im not gonna big up the harris here I dont need to,a well conditioned harris needs no-one to blow its horn...but please dont go for it because it is an easy option....you will learn (if learning about falconry is what you are after)so much more about falconry from a red..... the beauty and the tragedy of the harris is its very forgiving nature, so it will allow so much slack management..then when youve finished with the bird and think your an expert...you move "on" (god I hate that where harris are concerned ..move on my arse..) to a proper bird (and beleive me do a harris right and you will have no need to move on) then you will really appreciate why they so wrongfully call the harris a beginners bird, when it really should be labelled the most versatile bird in falconry...so versatile even a numpty can do it (badly).. so by all means go for a harris, not because its easiest, but because you really want a harris...go out see a few birds of different species with different falconers fly, and you will then, hopefully come to the right decision for the right reasons...
not bigging up the harris....that is me under enthusing about its abilities...


Punterpaul is of top quality when it comes to advice which is why i trusted him in my first ever outing with a Harris Falconer that he had trained.He gave me his number as he was close to me and said 'He will look after you mate'
I rang up his mate full of enthusiasm and pure adrenalin all suited up with new glove at the ready!
Its was a long day but i will try to keep it brief.
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.He rang me up this morning to say that Yesterday his Harris would not come down from a tree for hours so ...'Sorry mate she is a bit overweight see you next week.

A falconer that has been taught well by his mentor........:lol:

[HunterPaul]

I really must say ...lee the guy in question, was not mentored through me, in any way shape or form..I met him through somebody else who was taking him hunting and advising him .... but by the same token lee did spend a couple of seasons out in the field doing the ferreting and didnt entertain the idea of a bird until the guy who was taking him out gave him the nod...
you can only pass on your knowledge it is then up to the individual how they use it ...for good or for evil.....
but please please please do not think lee was given advise by me on anything other than his ferret...and his marriage..
I have never sat waiting for a bird sitting in a tree because the weight was wrong ...and I would have told lee that if he had anysuspision of the weight of the bird to first see how keen it was while on the creance.
then I would have given him a crash course on keeping a diary and weight management...
I like to initially keep a diary of how my bird reacts at what weight..then i can look back and see whats what...
hope that clears things up...

[JFSeaman]

I agree with Kanati.

No second hand birds for beginners. They could be inexpensive but you are getting what you pay for.

You did youself the best service by asking, never stop asking. Other falconers know stuff you don't and want to share it with you so that you know it to. The falconry community is one of the best places to be for sharing knowledge and experiences.

Contact or join a club. Try the Welsh Hawking Club http://www.welshhawkingclub.com/

Get a sponsor and local help. A sponsor is someone to discuss what bird to get and why, to call when things go pear shaped and to go hunting with.

Take a course, go to falconry centers.

Get someone with a relationship to recommend a breeder of the type of bird you decide on.

Take a course, go to a falconry center.

Get Nick Fox's 'Understanding Birds of Prey' and Phillip Glasiers 'Falconry & Hawking' from Amazon.

Take a couse.

Read the above books.

Talk to your local vet before getting a bird and make sure they have an idea what to do and who to call when the vet is stumped.

Read the FAQ and Guidence on the Hawk Board site http://www.hawkboard.org.uk/

Read this from the North American Falconry Association http://www.n-a-f-a.org/htm/aboutfal_main.htm.
Ignore the age and law stuff, you are in Wales and those are for US.

Get a Male Red Tail if you want to learn how to be a falconer. Get a Make Harris Hawk if you are time limited and just want to fly a bird and hunt. If you plan on getting additional birds ever, get a Make Red Tail, you will learn more and that will help with other birds later.

Disclaimer: I don't give courses.

[Minty]

I really must say ...lee the guy in question, was not mentored through me, in any way shape or form..I met him through somebody else who was taking him hunting and advising him .... but by the same token lee did spend a couple of seasons out in the field doing the ferreting and didnt entertain the idea of a bird until the guy who was taking him out gave him the nod...
you can only pass on your knowledge it is then up to the individual how they use it ...for good or for evil.....
but please please please do not think lee was given advise by me on anything other than his ferret...and his marriage..
I have never sat waiting for a bird sitting in a tree because the weight was wrong ...and I would have told lee that if he had anysuspision of the weight of the bird to first see how keen it was while on the creance.
then I would have given him a crash course on keeping a diary and weight management...
I like to initially keep a diary of how my bird reacts at what weight..then i can look back and see whats what...
hope that clears things up...


No paul is correct i was pulling his leg . But he Did go out with him a few times and speaking to lee on the phone rather entertained the idea of playing with pauls ferrets again next week.
Its getting a bit of a worry . Am i reading to much into this Falconry talk or are they playing with each others ferrets each week just a secret way of saying that splinter group of falconers are at work here. I do not mind its the 21st century no problem with me Paul and Lee.:goodman:

[FlameHairedFalconer]

Extremely sound advice mate - all beginners on this site could do with reading your post before joining the forum. It would clear up so much of the "Im a beginner, where do I start?" posts.

I agree with Kanati.

No second hand birds for beginners. They could be inexpensive but you are getting what you pay for.

You did youself the best service by asking, never stop asking. Other falconers know stuff you don't and want to share it with you so that you know it to. The falconry community is one of the best places to be for sharing knowledge and experiences.

Contact or join a club. Try the Welsh Hawking Club http://www.welshhawkingclub.com/

Get a sponsor and local help. A sponsor is someone to discuss what bird to get and why, to call when things go pear shaped and to go hunting with.

Take a course, go to falconry centers.

Get someone with a relationship to recommend a breeder of the type of bird you decide on.

Take a course, go to a falconry center.

Get Nick Fox's 'Understanding Birds of Prey' and Phillip Glasiers 'Falconry & Hawking' from Amazon.

Take a couse.

Read the above books.

Talk to your local vet before getting a bird and make sure they have an idea what to do and who to call when the vet is stumped.

Read the FAQ and Guidence on the Hawk Board site http://www.hawkboard.org.uk/

Read this from the North American Falconry Association http://www.n-a-f-a.org/htm/aboutfal_main.htm.
Ignore the age and law stuff, you are in Wales and those are for US.

Get a Male Red Tail if you want to learn how to be a falconer. Get a Make Harris Hawk if you are time limited and just want to fly a bird and hunt. If you plan on getting additional birds ever, get a Make Red Tail, you will learn more and that will help with other birds later.

Disclaimer: I don't give courses.

[Barbary Boy]

hi people i live in mid wales and i cant make my mind up on weather to get a male/female redtail or harris can you please give me your thoughts thanks form the scouser in wales
harris for sure if its your 1st bird,having said that the americans mostly go for redtails for thier apprentices. Ihave flown both and feel the h/hawk is more versitile,the best bird i ever had for rabbits was a male redtail he was brilliant,though credit to mark wardly from scotland coz he trained him.at the end of the day get what you really fancy youll be fine,good luck whatever you go for,regards keith.

[DorsetAde]

I had the same situation as you a few months ago, many of the people I knew that were already into falconry were pushing me towards a HH. I did some research and found the RT was the beginners bird before the HH came on the scene. I had all of the "tales" about the agressive nature and so on of a RT but I have to say that in the end i decided I would rather have abird I could work hard with to get it right rather than an HH that was probably more intelligent than me !!!

Ive had my RT a couple of weeks and he's doing great, not agressive and apart from the odd tethering problem, we're both doing all right so far thanks to some good advice from the guys (and girls) on this forum.

Best of luck with whatever you choose.

Ade

[Harrisii]

(QUOTE):
Get a Male Red Tail if you want to learn how to be a falconer. Get a Make Harris Hawk if you are time limited and just want to fly a bird and hunt. If you plan on getting additional birds ever, get a Make Red Tail, you will learn more and that will help with other birds later.

WHAT A LOT OF GUFF!! I THOUGHT FLYING A BIRD AND HUNTING WITH IT WAS FALCONRY. GET A REDTAIL IF YOU WANT TO LEARN TO BE A FALCONER. **** OFF!!
WHEN DID YOU TAKE UP THIS SPORT?


Another reason to go for a harris over a redtail which has not been mentioned is that they can be flown in either a cast of small groups.
when you get a hawk no doubt you will drag others into it, willingly. or, you will no doubt meet others or already know other people involved so you will quite easily be out with other people with harrises. with a red tail this aint quite so straightforward.

about the "too easy" statement. yes the harris is easier to train than the RT but a lot can still be learned through training these birds. i find it hard to imagine that someone training a harris will get the wrong impression and think all birds are just as straight-forward. poppycock. anyone who has successfully trained a harris and achieved the full spectrum of its abilities will not be a novice but will have been flying it for a few seasons. there after, they will have had first hand experience of its versatility and courage and prowess. by this time a redtail will just not do anything for them.
i would go for a harris every time, and push it to its limits, and beyond.

[FlameHairedFalconer]

i would go for a harris every time, and push it to its limits, and beyond.

Which is great if you know what you are doing! If you are a beginner, you will need to spend many seasons with the same hawk, whereby you both learn and grow.

I had my last harris for 8 years - he was my first hunting hawk, and I have just picked up another. I love harrises - they are wonderful, versitile, personable hawks. Capable of taking anything from a frog to a hare, and providing great sport regardless of the quarry!

Perhaps that is the lesson here....whatever you do get, get it with the intention of keeping it and flying it over many seasons.

FHF

[HunterPaul]

here here fhf..... Im all for keeping a bird and not off loading it to ...move on.. or up or any other misguided phrase used ... Up the harris...oops should rephrase that...

[Coedhirion]

Better still, don't get a bird at all untill you have spent at least one hunting season (5 to 6 days a week) out with an experienced falconer. You have to have the bird, equipment, a good few hundred acres of good hawking land, prefferably at least one dog and ferret, plus a second pair of hands to help watch them all. Without enough quarry being put up, a Redtail and a Harris will soon get bored, which leads to screaming, footing and all the rest.
We go out around 4 hours a day 6 days a week from sept. to April. Can you give a bird this much time? if not join forces with some one else is my advice. You can have all the fun without the responsibility and learn plenty, so you will eventualy know for your self which bird you want and will suit you best.

[Harris110773]

hi all i would like to thank you all very much for the advise it has given me alot to think about i have already been on a cause and i know falconry is the way for me i just need to deside m/f rt or hh hope you all have a good season andy the scouser in wales:supz:

[Raseni]

I bought a MHH as my first bird, but I was also thinking of a RT, but now I am quite happy I bought the HH. I bought him straight out of the aviary from this year, and did all the training myself. He is an excellent bird, and a very aggressive hunter, but I was also fortunate to have a mentor who helped me out, and of course all you guys on here :-)
so far we have had 2 grey partridges and one pheasant, and I have only had him since late august, so 3 super flights in 1½ month is ok for me. He has had more chances but has missed by an inch, but hey that´s what it is all about, you can win every time. He is very tame, but I have also spent SO many hours manning him, and after every flight, he comes in the living room with me, to get heated up before he goes to him aviary for the night.
He has been very forgiving with me, and the mistakes I have made. Especially when he was still on creance. he landed in a near by tree, and it was a ****** to get him down, and that put me some days back in training, but NOW he is doing great.
The only problem with him is he is so agrresive towards quarry, he will fly at an adult roe deer, even when quite high in weight. Which could lead to problems, fortunaly he has not yet binded to a roe deer, and I hope he won´t, as that will only lead to baaad stuff. He thinks he is an harpy in the field, and a parrot in the house.
But I guess what I am trying to say is thatm HH are great birds, (talking about the few I have worked with, my mentors´ birds and my own,) And if trained with help from another falconer, and a portion of common sense, a HH can be a great bop to fly and takes much of the quarry a gos will, so for the beginner I think it is an ideal bird.

But I would also not recommend getting a second hand bird, as being a beginner it´s hard enough not to F**K up your own bird, not the least, repairing another falconers F**Kups, so, whatever you choose, choose an eyas bird straight out the aviary, and you will have a thrill training him/her and later working in the field. The satisfactory grade also seem greater when you have done ALL the hard work yourself.

just my 2 cents,

cheers
RaS

[Falcon911]

Harris every time. No contest. I can't be bothered to explain why but just get a Harris!!

Cheers
Andy

[Harrisii]

Harris every time. No contest. I can't be bothered to explain why but just get a Harris!!

Cheers
Andy

here, here andy, sound advise.
anyway, harris70113, the clue is in your user name.

[Coedhirion]

As said above, a good Harris is more forgiving of some mistakes. tho not robbing it of a kill. Watch and learn the art of a good pick up. It is probably a lot more versatile than a Redtail, tho RT lovers will of course disagree.

[JFSeaman]

(QUOTE):
GET A REDTAIL IF YOU WANT TO LEARN TO BE A FALCONER. **** OFF!!


Gee Harrisii you make such a good ambasador for falconry. Personal insults and all.

[Barbary Boy]

everyone debates over red tail/harris for a 1st bird,all the modern books/centers virtually demand that beginers need to take a course.and that the likes of a kestrel is out of the question. i ,like most of my peers started with the good old kestrel and i got mine after only reading 2 books and never having met another falconer,i trained her on my own and yes it took longer than it should have done but i did it.the trouble is most of the falconers out there now are brought up on h/hawks and there are so many falconry centres pushing for buisiness that beginers feel this is the only way to go. the noted american falconer frank beebe gives what i believe to be excellent advice, (get the bird that is right for your curcumstances!) you beginers out there have never been so lucky there will be a falconer near you wherever you live and even if they have only flown a harris hawk they will be able to help. the trouble with courses is while there are some very good ones there are lots where the owners have jumpt on the falconry "band waggon". it is incredably easy to set up an enterprise and bamboozle the public with the incredible feats of "barny the barn owl" and "eagy the eagle owl" BUT you would be horrified to know how many of these "centres"are run by extremely inexperinced falconers or people who have never hunted yet are taking peoples money to pass on the "noble art" if you are keen enough and dedicated enough it doesnt matter what you get you will succeed. (get the bird that is right for your curcumstaces)

[Blaze]

Hi
I Would Definatly Go For A Female Harris As I Know A Few People Who Have Or Have Had Redtails They Are Generaly Aggresive Towards Thier Handlers At Times

[JFSeaman]

Bravo Barbary Boy,

I lost the point of the question and was too literal. As you say get the bird that is right for your circumstances.

And of course being a silly trusting american the thought of an unscrupulous operator never occurred to me. Not all centers are the same. But feel lucky, in the US there aren't any. The US can't have centers like what we can have in the UK because of laws, regulations and liability law suits.

About that kestrel. You have my respect. You are a true falconer.

[Barbary Boy]

Bravo Barbary Boy,

I lost the point of the question and was too literal. As you say get the bird that is right for your circumstances.

And of course being a silly trusting american the thought of an unscrupulous operator never occurred to me. Not all centers are the same. But feel lucky, in the US there aren't any. The US can't have centers like what we can have in the UK because of laws, regulations and liability law suits.

About that kestrel. You have my respect. You are a true falconer.
i wish we didnt have so many f@@@@ng centers in UK the majority of them are ****,only looking to make money,and run by amature ar@@@@es, people are taken in by them and ripped off,you dont need to pay daft amounts of money to learn falconry,Read a few books, join a club, find a falconer.There is no mystery to our (ART)just common sense and perseverence.

[Colohen]

(QUOTE):
anyone who has successfully trained a harris and achieved the full spectrum of its abilities will not be a novice but will have been flying it for a few seasons. there after, they will have had first hand experience of its versatility and courage and prowess. by this time a redtail will just not do anything for them.
.Try again Harrisii !
Worked with both, been on hunts with both, mono-y-mono the RT is tops! I flew my RT for 5 years and I know some that are still flying the same RT going on 15 years:supz: I really love my FHH :-P She is more agressive then any RT I have ever handled and I handle a lot!! (Falconer/Rehabilitator) .Of all the BOP I have handled wild or tame falconry or rehab, I have only seen the Gos to be more agrissave. And I have seen no RT more agressive then any of the 3 HH I have had. It is not allways the training but the nature of the BOP has to be taken into consideration as wall!
The RT relies in its own skill and strength while Harris hawk was born to fly in cast and work best this way. You wont to see a real Harris you need to watch the intelagence of a wild cast at work. They are more like a pack of wolves, swarming in like vultures, while one districts, cuts off and/or runs there entended pray back into the pack just waiting to suprize they're victim.
If I knew I would be flying with others I'd pick the HH ! And alone , the RT!!
It is all a mater of what, where, who and how.

[oldpoacher]

reds are slow sulky bad manerd buzzards thats all they are all they will ever be , now the harris is a freindly bird with a turn of speed more so than of the red tail not by much but it is that wee bit faster and , why put up with a slow red tail when you can have a slightly faster harris which wont **** you of and somtimes make you want to wring its neck ! lol the harris is the better bird the price difrence between them tells you that lol i love the old red tail fans they are just like there birds stuborn usles twats , JMO :butthead: :finga: ................

[JFSeaman]

It's wonderful for all you in the UK who can buy any bird that you want.

Want a HH, go buy it, want a gos, go buy it. Falcon, eagle, large owl, same same same.

The US guys don't have those options.

As for RTs being sulky, moody, stubborn and bad tempered. No argument!

Always get the bird that suites your circumstances and goals and desires.

I got a RT!

Oh yeah, I'm sulky, moody, stubborn and bad tempered! ... ;)

[Colohen]

My FHH is sulky,moody,stubborn,temperemental,pretentious,pre sumptuious,agnostic,unpredictable and has a short attention span, ! Boy ,glade I didnt get a imprint!!:lol: :lol:

[Tr1gger]

:lol: Thats females for u though

[MickeyDredd]

reds are slow sulky bad manerd buzzards thats all they are all they will ever be , now the harris is a freindly bird with a turn of speed more so than of the red tail not by much but it is that wee bit faster and , why put up with a slow red tail when you can have a slightly faster harris which wont **** you of and somtimes make you want to wring its neck ! lol the harris is the better bird the price difrence between them tells you that lol i love the old red tail fans they are just like there birds stuborn usles twats , JMO :butthead: :finga: ................

Welcome Oldpoacher

Hopefully your future posts won't be such a load of b*llocks as your first!!

A RT which behaves in the way described has a cr*p austringer as a partner - have you ever flown one?

PS I fly both a HH & a FRT.

[Wilded]

Man what a crock! Fly a passage red tailed hawk and learn what a bird can do.

[Barbary Boy]

reds are slow sulky bad manerd buzzards thats all they are all they will ever be , now the harris is a freindly bird with a turn of speed more so than of the red tail not by much but it is that wee bit faster and , why put up with a slow red tail when you can have a slightly faster harris which wont **** you of and somtimes make you want to wring its neck ! lol the harris is the better bird the price difrence between them tells you that lol i love the old red tail fans they are just like there birds stuborn usles twats , JMO :butthead: :finga: ................
couldnt dissagree with you more,harris hawks are more versatile but the best rabbitt hawk i ever flew was a male red tail. and that includes goses.you obviouslly are a relative beginner who hasent had the fore sight to try different birds before making such a bone head statement, iam currently flying a h/hawk but am a bit embarressed about it because most h/hawkers are like you, inexperienced ********s!

[Blaze]

Now Now we all new naf all at some point! lol

[Barbary Boy]

Sorry Blaze, but tits like "old poacher " boil my ****, he may be an old poacher but he obviously knows f**k all about falconry making statements like that! This is the problem with the sport, dont get me wrong i am flying a f h/hawk at the moment but most people coming into the sport have come from a lurcher/ferreting-poaching sort of background,or seen barny the amazing barn owl fly at a "center".they come into the sport ,have a bit of sucsess with the innevatable h/hawk then think they are jack f***ing mavrogodarto? old poacher has probably never even heard of him.i wish i was a millionaire i would give "old poacher"a passage gos and let him get on with it. "OLD POACHER HAVE YOU EVER FLOWN A RED TAIL"

[Barbary Boy]

It's wonderful for all you in the UK who can buy any bird that you want.

Want a HH, go buy it, want a gos, go buy it. Falcon, eagle, large owl, same same same.

The US guys don't have those options.

As for RTs being sulky, moody, stubborn and bad tempered. No argument!

Always get the bird that suites your circumstances and goals and desires.

I got a RT!

Oh yeah, I'm sulky, moody, stubborn and bad tempered! ... ;)
YOUVE been reading my posts, b/boy.

[HunterPaul]

Sorry Blaze, but tits like "old poacher " boil my ****, he may be an old poacher but he obviously knows f**k all about falconry making statements like that! This is the problem with the sport, dont get me wrong i am flying a f h/hawk at the moment but most people coming into the sport have come from a lurcher/ferreting-poaching sort of background,or seen barny the amazing barn owl fly at a "center".they come into the sport ,have a bit of sucsess with the innevatable h/hawk then think they are jack f***ing mavrogodarto? old poacher has probably never even heard of him.i wish i was a millionaire i would give "old poacher"a passage gos and let him get on with it. "OLD POACHER HAVE YOU EVER FLOWN A RED TAIL"
fpmsl...lol...pmsl...this makes up for all that tosh you were on about with the owls ....you have made my chuffing night ....top post lol ha ha ha:-D

[Blaze]

Sorry Blaze, but tits like "old poacher " boil my ****, he may be an old poacher but he obviously knows f**k all about falconry making statements like that! This is the problem with the sport, dont get me wrong i am flying a f h/hawk at the moment but most people coming into the sport have come from a lurcher/ferreting-poaching sort of background,or seen barny the amazing barn owl fly at a "center".they come into the sport ,have a bit of sucsess with the innevatable h/hawk then think they are jack f***ing mavrogodarto? old poacher has probably never even heard of him.i wish i was a millionaire i would give "old poacher"a passage gos and let him get on with it. "OLD POACHER HAVE YOU EVER FLOWN A RED TAIL"I know where your coming from mate!
Allthough i was into running dogs (still am) i started looking into falconry when i realised as i grew up that you didnt need licenses/permits blardy bla...........Ive always had a passion for bop's...........Iv still got a vid n book on bop's that my dad got me when i was i kid.........Im glad i didn't get one when i was younger cos i know where my prioritys are now im fending for myself........And its definatley my stunning fhh..........Missus recons i should be engaged to my bird then her.........Atleast she knows where my prioritys lie MY FHH.........ABSOLUTLY LOVING IT!

[Barbary Boy]

do you really think i was talking tosh about the owls hunter paul?

[HunterPaul]

I like owls and owl people and they in my opinion are more than welcome on the forum...so i suppose that is a yes...but you did make me **** the other night....which is always appreciated...

[Barbary Boy]

i try my best m8.

[Barbary Boy]

blaze! dont get me wrong im not knocking anyone who was, or is into any thing else, but i get tired of meeting new people all the time who tell you they have a barn owl then wait for you to look impressed, then they drop the bombshell "next year im going to get(wait with bated breath) a bengal eagle owl"your then expected to stand back in amazement, likewise everyone and thier granny has a h/hawk around here now and thier all f***ing experts.most of them think they are gods gift to falconry,but actually show the sport up in a very poor light,sorry to go on but i feel stongly about this.

[HunterPaul]

i agree with you in the most part...I would love to see less idiots walking about with a harris hawk on their fists....unfortunately the reputation of these people bleeds over on to the birds. and lo and behold the harris is ****.... but there are plenty of so called experienced falconers out there that have killed many a gos or spar and a harris...unfortunately for the birds in this country ..if you have the money you can buy what you like and if the price of hh went up and the price of gos' came down ..guess what the idiots would be flying ...then the gos would become the clitoris hawk...(every c**ts got one) if some of the breeders in this country spent more time vetting the people that they are about to sell their young birds to...then maybe there would be a slightly smaller problem...I know you breed birds and Im not chucking you into the same pile of ******s Im talking about ...even though I dont know you you sound from what I can tell a responsible person...but there is no escaping the fact that there are breeders out there that will say any old ***** just to get the money in there hands and the birds off their property..I dont do the owl thing...and although I have some affection for the birds I fly ..I dont see them as a pet...and I dont expect to see it alive again the moment it has left my fist...thats the way it goes...
but most of the owl type people that I meet seem to have genuine affection and love for the individual birds they have...there are always exceptions...and even though to a certain extent the connection to falconry is not direct...they are a bird of prey and in that awaken something in me, that a hawk does...so I do enjoy reading the threads on the owls as well as the falconry....you obviously feel differently...absolutely entitled to that....

[Pitbull]

I here to many people saying that the hh has help falconry but the more i see and hear i think in the next few years it will be like a lead wait too falconry, one selling point i hear many times is it is like the dog of the bop and thats why people get it, they think its as easy as keeping a dog. To much of this whats better than what read the books speak falconers and only you yourself can say what is the right bird (thats if your the right person for the bird)

[Blaze]

blaze! dont get me wrong im not knocking anyone who was, or is into any thing else, but i get tired of meeting new people all the time who tell you they have a barn owl then wait for you to look impressed, then they drop the bombshell "next year im going to get(wait with bated breath) a bengal eagle owl"your then expected to stand back in amazement, likewise everyone and thier granny has a h/hawk around here now and thier all f***ing experts.most of them think they are gods gift to falconry,but actually show the sport up in a very poor light,sorry to go on but i feel stongly about this.
I totaly understand where your coming from mate........There are a lot of *****s with bop's who have them just to say they've got one...........Theirs a lad ive seen n spoke to around here thats got a male harris in its second year he just walks the streets with it on his fist loving the attention wont let it off too scared it wont come back..........Im not an expert but his bird just gets fed chicks and you can see the bird looks poor..........................What a shame it ****es me off when i see him talking to people when he knows **** all about the sport or the birds welfare.........To him its just like walking arround with a staffie

[HunterPaul]

is that staffie or stiffy...and that is not a toilet joke ...the hawk is obviously a penis extension

[Blaze]

is that staffie or stiffy...and that is not a toilet joke ...the hawk is obviously a penis extension
If it was a stiffy he was walking round with you'd be straight up m1 to meet him..........Knob jockey :goodman:

[MickeyDredd]

I here to many people saying that the hh has help falconry but the more i see and hear i think in the next few years it will be like a lead wait too falconry, one selling point i hear many times is it is like the dog of the bop and thats why people get it, they think its as easy as keeping a dog. To much of this whats better than what read the books speak falconers and only you yourself can say what is the right bird (thats if your the right person for the bird)

Pitbull

You are right but this though is not the fault of the Harris, rather it is down to the lack of regulation as to who can obtain a hawk. The harris has made falconry more accessible for many of us, me included for which I am hugely grateful, but whilst anyone with a couple of hundred quid can buy one without any experience whatsoever (as demonstrated time and time again on this very forum) we're on the rocky road to ruin!