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  #11  
Old 13-09-2011, 07:20 PM
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Sean Donnelly
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Default Re: Harris Hawk training method

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Originally Posted by Toz View Post
why would you think a hh is not clever anough to know you left the food, do you think when you put the food down without the bird seeing you would trick the bird, the bird knows you left the food, in one breath we say these birds are super clever then next were saying there stupid because they will never work out who left it, we all know what ever you do is never going to make any difference, i feed my fhh anywere i want inside outside to her it does not matter and she is silent for now anyway it might be different when i bring her weight down but these books only confuse us i think because every bird are different.
There's your answer Vorx, forget JPJ and Phillip Glasier just follow Toz' posts
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  #12  
Old 13-09-2011, 07:25 PM
Toz Toz is offline
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Default Re: Harris Hawk training method

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Originally Posted by Sean D View Post
There's your answer Vorx, forget JPJ and Phillip Glasier just follow Toz' posts
well i have at least tried to say somthing constructive, rather than be like you and your mate rene sneering from the side lines lol
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  #13  
Old 13-09-2011, 07:26 PM
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Ash Lawson
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Default Re: Harris Hawk training method

The thing with these speedy no food association get the bird hunting quick methods is they rely on the austringer being good enough to get the bird going in a week or two. In reality most new austringers will not be experienced enough and thus the method is useless to them. There's more than one way to skin a deer and I've never had a problem using the more conventional methods. I wouldn't do it any other way because I've no need to I guess it could work for some people!
To the original poster, do you have a mentor/teacher? If so and you can see from their bird that they know what they're about, then do as they instruct and don't chop and change methods, less chance of confusion then!
Atb
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  #14  
Old 13-09-2011, 07:33 PM
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Rob Baxter
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Default Re: Harris Hawk training method

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Originally Posted by CotswoldRedtail View Post
The thing with these speedy no food association get the bird hunting quick methods is they rely on the austringer being good enough to get the bird going in a week or two. In reality most new austringers will not be experienced enough and thus the method is useless to them. There's more than one way to skin a deer and I've never had a problem using the more conventional methods. I wouldn't do it any other way because I've no need to I guess it could work for some people!
To the original poster, do you have a mentor/teacher? If so and you can see from their bird that they know what they're about, then do as they instruct and don't chop and change methods, less chance of confusion then!
Atb
Hi Ash,

Yeah I have got a couple of people to mentor me both of which have had HH and a mate of mine has just got one so am learning from him by watching from the sidelines etc. I don't think I ever really intended to venture too far from the path and would follow the PG/JPJ method as that is the way they have all done it.

I was just surprised how the two opinions/methods were completely opposed and wanted some feedback from you more experienced austringers out there to see if there was any good reason why they were so differing. Thanks for your feedback though it is really appreciated, I am learning day by day and that is only thanks to the experience of others being generously passed on.

ATB

Rob
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  #15  
Old 13-09-2011, 07:35 PM
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Default Re: Harris Hawk training method

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toz View Post
why would you think a hh is not clever anough to know you left the food, do you think when you put the food down without the bird seeing you would trick the bird, the bird knows you left the food, in one breath we say these birds are super clever then next were saying there stupid because they will never work out who left it, we all know what ever you do is never going to make any difference, i feed my fhh anywere i want inside outside to her it does not matter and she is silent for now anyway it might be different when i bring her weight down but these books only confuse us i think because every bird are different.

Jesus here we go - I said I didnt want a debate didnt I! I didn't friggin well say a HH is not clever enough to know who left the food but I can assure you that it doesnt have the same impact as feeding on the fist! In my opinion/experience even openly throwing the food down on the floor next to the bird on the bow doesn't have the same impact either
You may well have a silent HH now - they are all individuals but we can follow a training regime that lessens the chance of the bird becoming imprinted and very vocal. Is it really not worth trying to avoid it??!
I do hope your bird doesn't become vocal when you bring it's weight down (and that is when it happens!!) - it will be a pain in the rear......

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vorx View Post
Pete - the quote I referenced came from here http://home.comcast.net/~baywingdb/traintips.htm
not sure about the glove association.

Andy - thanks for the input. I am no where near ready to start actually training a hawk still in the early stages of my learning and like to understand as much as possible and enjoy a good debate over different methodology without it descending into the usual the tit for tat. Are you still flying your HH?

Rob
Rob,

No....but I am just getting one to fly again and I will be trying as hard as poss not to imprint it by feeding lots on the fist. I would strongly suggest (unless you are deaf and don't have any neighbours) that you do the same.

Cheers
Andy
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  #16  
Old 13-09-2011, 08:20 PM
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Ash Lawson
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Default Re: Harris Hawk training method

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Originally Posted by Vorx View Post
Hi Ash,

Yeah I have got a couple of people to mentor me both of which have had HH and a mate of mine has just got one so am learning from him by watching from the sidelines etc. I don't think I ever really intended to venture too far from the path and would follow the PG/JPJ method as that is the way they have all done it.

I was just surprised how the two opinions/methods were completely opposed and wanted some feedback from you more experienced austringers out there to see if there was any good reason why they were so differing. Thanks for your feedback though it is really appreciated, I am learning day by day and that is only thanks to the experience of others being generously passed on.

ATB

Rob
As I say mate, more than one way to achieve the same results, some taking longer than others, some more useful than others depending on the results you're after and your individual situation. All too often people will have you believe their way is the only way. As long as the methods used do not risk the bird then there's no right way in my opinion, as long as the bird comes first.
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  #17  
Old 13-09-2011, 08:23 PM
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Rob Baxter
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Default Re: Harris Hawk training method

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Originally Posted by CotswoldRedtail View Post
As I say mate, more than one way to achieve the same results, some taking longer than others, some more useful than others depending on the results you're after and your individual situation. All too often people will have you believe their way is the only way. As long as the methods used do not risk the bird then there's no right way in my opinion, as long as the bird comes first.
Sounds like sound advice cheers Ash.
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  #18  
Old 13-09-2011, 09:08 PM
arcticgun arcticgun is offline
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Default Re: Harris Hawk training method

was it not Glaister who said that if 'your going to learn from a book, pick one book and stick with it' ? Im pleased I picked his book, bird is coming along well and the methods in in his book definately work not read the JPJ books as yet, but heard she is Gllaisters daughter??? could be wrong though, but her books where recomended along with Glaisters by a mate
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  #19  
Old 13-09-2011, 09:19 PM
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HallBeck HallBeck is offline
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Default Re: Harris Hawk training method

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Originally Posted by arcticgun View Post
was it not Glaister who said that if 'your going to learn from a book, pick one book and stick with it' ? Im pleased I picked his book, bird is coming along well and the methods in in his book definately work not read the JPJ books as yet, but heard she is Gllaisters daughter??? could be wrong though, but her books where recomended along with Glaisters by a mate
If by "Glaister" you mean Glasier - then you are right. JPJ is indeed Philip Glasier's daughter.
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  #20  
Old 13-09-2011, 09:23 PM
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Default Re: Harris Hawk training method

Well after reading this i most put my veiws in,after flying and training harrisis with who i would say some of the best falconers in the north east for 15 years ,and them for ovwer 30 years+if a harris is going to scream its going to scream,you could train it 10 different ways and it still might scream,my advice is parent reared,with parents until at least 18 weeks,get it maned as you dropping weight,get it flying free and hunting as soon as,and it might still scream
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