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  #1  
Old 30-06-2007, 10:09 AM
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Fred Seaman
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Default Saker x Lanner

I searched for previous postings but didn't find anything specific.

I am interested in any information on this cross. It seems for my purposes a good set up. They will be hunted in southern and central California so the climates should match the cross perfectly.

Saker: strength, stamina & size : a strong falcon, with sufficient stamina to tail chase its prey to exhaustion.

Lanner: agility & timing : with the exception of the Lanner, all falcons attack prey in flight from behind, flying in the same direction as the prey. The Lanner falcon is prepared to take its prey from the front, flying in the opposite direction, giving a much higher relative velocity, requiring improved agility & timing to catch the prey.

So doing the hybrids maths: a Saker/Lanner should be: agile with good timing, strong and bold, not as big and strong as a Saker but bigger and stronger than a Lanner and able to handle the warm dry climate of souther California.

I've heard good things about the overall disposition of this cross and good things about the cross for display birds.

What about hunting, anyone tried it? I don't expect it to be brilliant in the UK it's for warmer climates.

What size were the birds?

Anyone got pics?
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  #2  
Old 30-06-2007, 12:22 PM
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Default Re: Saker x Lanner

hi fred, the best man to ask is griff of mj hoods he flew one for a short while.

all the best chris.
Ps; see you at the festival could be the last time i see you before you go.
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  #3  
Old 30-06-2007, 12:51 PM
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Jim Entwistle
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Default Re: Saker x Lanner

Quote:
Originally Posted by JFSeaman View Post
I searched for previous postings but didn't find anything specific.

I am interested in any information on this cross. It seems for my purposes a good set up. They will be hunted in southern and central California so the climates should match the cross perfectly.

Saker: strength, stamina & size : a strong falcon, with sufficient stamina to tail chase its prey to exhaustion.

Lanner: agility & timing : with the exception of the Lanner, all falcons attack prey in flight from behind, flying in the same direction as the prey. The Lanner falcon is prepared to take its prey from the front, flying in the opposite direction, giving a much higher relative velocity, requiring improved agility & timing to catch the prey.

So doing the hybrids maths: a Saker/Lanner should be: agile with good timing, strong and bold, not as big and strong as a Saker but bigger and stronger than a Lanner and able to handle the warm dry climate of souther California.

I've heard good things about the overall disposition of this cross and good things about the cross for display birds.

What about hunting, anyone tried it? I don't expect it to be brilliant in the UK it's for warmer climates.

What size were the birds?

Anyone got pics?

I've always wondered when people quote hybred strenghts, the offspring only gets the good points and non of the weaknesses of the parents.

As with a lot of hybreds, they don't replace what's already available by nature, predator and quarry equally matched by nature.

Why couldn't you just fly a saker ? Surely if you alter the wing shape etc of the offspring, it might not fly like either of the parents and could even be worse than the originals.

Jim.
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  #4  
Old 30-06-2007, 02:48 PM
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Default Re: Saker x Lanner

Quote:
Originally Posted by OutFlying View Post
I've always wondered when people quote hybred strenghts, the offspring only gets the good points and non of the weaknesses of the parents.

As with a lot of hybreds, they don't replace what's already available by nature, predator and quarry equally matched by nature.

Why couldn't you just fly a saker ? Surely if you alter the wing shape etc of the offspring, it might not fly like either of the parents and could even be worse than the originals.

Jim.
Agreed,
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  #5  
Old 30-06-2007, 04:04 PM
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Default Re: Saker x Lanner

Quote:
Originally Posted by OutFlying View Post
I've always wondered when people quote hybred strenghts, the offspring only gets the good points and non of the weaknesses of the parents.

Why couldn't you just fly a saker ? Surely if you alter the wing shape etc of the offspring, it might not fly like either of the parents and could even be worse than the originals.

Jim.
I would agree with those 2 points. However I would think that if habitats of different species of falcons overlap then there is chance they could produce natural hybrids.

Scoff.
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  #6  
Old 30-06-2007, 08:04 PM
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Fred Seaman
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Default Re: Saker x Lanner

Quote:
Originally Posted by OutFlying View Post
I've always wondered when people quote hybred strenghts, the offspring only gets the good points and non of the weaknesses of the parents.

As with a lot of hybreds, they don't replace what's already available by nature, predator and quarry equally matched by nature.

Why couldn't you just fly a saker ? Surely if you alter the wing shape etc of the offspring, it might not fly like either of the parents and could even be worse than the originals.

Jim.
Good points Jim, that's why I'm asking first.

The weeknesses should be similar but only apply in the UK and are an asset were and how I intend to fly them. Specifically soft feathers and a belief that they are low pitch. Not a problem for what I want. As for pure saker, I want a little bit differrent than the expected of a pure saker behavior.

This hybrid has been done and I want to know how it worked out to determine if I would get a bird suited to purpose.

As for improving on nature, it's been proven we can improve on nature (depending on your view) for mans uses. If we had to live off the breed of vegetables from 1000 years ago we'd starve. When we hybridize we are speeding the process and for me necessity due to US laws.

A quick note on nature matched predator vs prey. You fly a gos I believe, against pheasants (but even if you are not many are so the point is valid). You are flying a native wet climate predator against a tropical non-native species in a wet weather climate. But for decades or longer it has been viewed as a classic falconry effort.
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  #7  
Old 30-06-2007, 08:24 PM
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Default Re: Saker x Lanner

I would favour a pere x saker
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  #8  
Old 30-06-2007, 08:29 PM
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Default Re: Saker x Lanner

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackbird View Post
I would favour a pere x saker
I appreciate that this proven hybrid has good attributes but in this case, can't and not appropriate for purpose.

Still looking for Saker x Lanner info.
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  #9  
Old 30-06-2007, 08:49 PM
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Default Re: Saker x Lanner

Quote:
Originally Posted by JFSeaman View Post
I appreciate that this proven hybrid has good attributes but in this case, can't and not appropriate for purpose.
Why?
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  #10  
Old 30-06-2007, 09:37 PM
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Default Re: Saker x Lanner

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackbird View Post
Why?
It's for the US not the UK and I don't feel the need to explain further. You know by now the falconry laws in the US can be oppressive.
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